Episode 66

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Published on:

22nd Feb 2023

S3E14 - Gone Full Borg

Join Laura and Xhafer, two internet strangers as they get to know each other while making jokes about one of their favorite TV shows from their childhood, Babylon 5.

Xhafer wants to play some disc golf. Bester returns to B5 to propose an alliance while he pursues a ship full of missing telepaths in Babylon 5, Season 3 Episode 14: Ship of Tears.

Transcript
Laura:

Hello and welcome to, who Are You?

Laura:

It's a Babylon five watch cast by a couple of former strangers, now friends

Laura:

who are continuing to get to know each other over one of their favorite

Laura:

shows from their childhood, Babylon.

Laura:

Five.

Laura:

I'm Laura,

Xhafer:

and I'm.

Laura:

and today I get to ask Ja Fare.

Laura:

What do you want?

Xhafer:

Well right now I'm really looking forward to some warmer weather.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

it was 18 here in Michigan, last week in, in the southeast Michigan area.

Xhafer:

It happens to be warmer than that right now.

Xhafer:

It's above freezing.

Xhafer:

It was actually raining instead of snowing earlier

Laura:

Oh, nice.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

And it's supposed to be 40 for a couple of days to my

Xhafer:

understanding of things this week.

Xhafer:

And I'm really looking forward to that because the disc golf season is upon us.

Xhafer:

And I don't know if I've talked about disc golf.

Xhafer:

I don't think I've maybe mentioned it maybe once or twice on pod.

Xhafer:

But I do disc golf as a hobby.

Xhafer:

I'm.

Laura:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

But I enjoy it.

Xhafer:

It, it's guided hiking.

Xhafer:

And I do follow like the professional scene.

Xhafer:

Like I'll sit down and I'll watch pro disc golf.

Laura:

So what is the Pro Disc golf season?

Xhafer:

the pro disc golf season is gonna start, I think, officially with

Xhafer:

the Las Vegas Open in like a month.

Xhafer:

And so we are in the pre-season zone right now, which is when all of the pros are

Xhafer:

changing their contracts around and stuff.

Laura:

They have contracts.

Laura:

Nice.

Laura:

Good for

Xhafer:

are at least two players with million dollar a year contracts to play

Laura:

Wow.

Laura:

Okay.

Xhafer:

And some of them make significantly more than

Xhafer:

that based off of disk sales.

Xhafer:

So how pro disk golf works, there's not really teams, right?

Xhafer:

It's an individual sport, but a lot of the big disk manufacturers

Xhafer:

are sponsoring players.

Laura:

Makes.

Xhafer:

And so I have a, like brand or two of disk that I tend to throw.

Xhafer:

I tend to prefer that lineup.

Xhafer:

For a couple of reasons.

Xhafer:

I won't get into the minutiae of it, but I throw MVP in Axiom mostly if you

Xhafer:

happen to be involved in no Disc golf.

Xhafer:

Part of that is they're local for me,

Laura:

Uhhuh

Xhafer:

they're a nationalist golf company that happens to

Xhafer:

be based out of around my area.

Xhafer:

And then also they do a couple different things with their DISC technology.

Xhafer:

uh, Helps I think new players specifically really.

Xhafer:

And then so that's kind of what I gravitated to.

Xhafer:

And then also a lot of, like when I was first getting started, none of the like,

Xhafer:

things about disks made sense to me.

Xhafer:

and they were the only manufacturer that had like a, this is what it looks

Xhafer:

like when you throw it from an overhead view like chart of all of the disks.

Xhafer:

And that visual representation just clicked with my brain.

Xhafer:

And so I'm like, oh, so I want one of these and one of these and one of

Xhafer:

these for these types of shots, right?

Xhafer:

And so I got started with them because of that, and I have just stuck with it now.

Xhafer:

But we're in that timeframe where the pro disk golfers are, if they are going

Xhafer:

to change their contracts for the year, they do it before the season starts.

Xhafer:

So one of my favorite disc golfers just changed over to throwing the

Xhafer:

manufacturer that I throw and being sponsored by my favorite manufacturer.

Xhafer:

So I'm like all hype up here about it.

Xhafer:

So I did my uh, pre-season purchasing and I bought five discs the other

Xhafer:

day, which is like a hundred bucks.

Xhafer:

The cool thing about disc golf that you don't get in a lot of

Xhafer:

other sports is everyone at every level is using the same equipment.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Like there is no like magic $500 thousand dollars disc that the

Xhafer:

pros throw that make them better.

Xhafer:

They're throwing the same $20 pieces of plastic that everyone else is,

Laura:

Right

Xhafer:

They're just better at.

Xhafer:

And then a lot of the disk golfers, the prodi golfers' income and their

Xhafer:

ability to tour comes from releasing disks with their name on it.

Xhafer:

They'll have like a tour, almost every sponsored player for one of

Xhafer:

the major companies has a tour disc, which is just their favorite disk

Xhafer:

with their name on it, or maybe a special little like logo or something.

Xhafer:

And then the like super high end, like a handful of like the super elite

Xhafer:

disc golf scene guys will have, and.

Xhafer:

Will have their own line of diss that they help design with the

Xhafer:

companies that they're sponsored by.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

And so at the start of the season, I have a couple dis

Xhafer:

golfers that I'm a big fan of.

Xhafer:

I'll usually buy a couple of their diss because it actually is like

Xhafer:

the, those sales are what enables them to actually go out on tour.

Xhafer:

Cuz most dis golfers make enough to get by and, you know,

Xhafer:

support their family and stuff.

Xhafer:

but only a couple are driving nice cars like

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Everybody else has a Camry, right?

Xhafer:

Yeah, pretty, there's a lot of that.

Xhafer:

And a lot of cohabitating on tour and stuff to reduce costs.

Xhafer:

So I do try to make a point of throwing a couple bucks in my favorite player's

Xhafer:

pockets by buying their diss in the preseason, and that was this time of

Xhafer:

year I just made that purchase that I make at the start of every season.

Xhafer:

So I'm real anxious to go out and.

Xhafer:

And I watched a lot of videos about my form and stuff, and I, I found a thing.

Xhafer:

I found I, I made a slight change to my practicing my uh, driving form that I

Xhafer:

haven't been able to actually go out and implement with an actual disc in my hand.

Xhafer:

But I can already tell, it just feels so much smoother.

Xhafer:

I'm really excited to just get out to like the park down the street and

Xhafer:

just throw like 30 discs in a row and

Xhafer:

just get a feel for it.

Laura:

we have a big city park that's very close to us and it has

Laura:

a big disc golf course, and I always feel very sorry for anyone who is.

Laura:

Dis golfing in Oklahoma City because of our wind situation.

Laura:

I can't imagine that that is a very fulfilling hobby here.

Laura:

oh my gosh.

Xhafer:

There are a couple places even out that way.

Xhafer:

Like Emporia, Kansas is a really big disc golf town.

Laura:

Yeah, I could see that being another windy place.

Laura:

Windy

Laura:

problem.

Xhafer:

notoriously windy place.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

If you ever come visit, you're gonna have to, we're gonna have to go out

Laura:

there and give it a shot, cuz I'm very curious as to what your opinion would be.

Xhafer:

That is something that I like to do when I travel,

Laura:

Yeah, of course.

Laura:

Try out all the disc golf courses.

Xhafer:

yeah.

Xhafer:

Well, when we were in Vegas, I was gonna.

Xhafer:

. But we ended up unable to get to a disc golf shop to buy like a used disc to

Xhafer:

be able to go, and we didn't bring any.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

But I went and played when I was in Hawaii.

Xhafer:

I played when I was in Scotland.

Xhafer:

You know, I've, I, I like to bring, I have like a small travel bag of

Xhafer:

discs of like, I'll, I'll bring like three or four with me to a

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

You know, I was in Baltimore a couple months ago.

Xhafer:

We went and played.

Xhafer:

Then I've got like my big bag for like local stuff, which has like more dis

Xhafer:

than I'm ever gonna throw at the course.

Xhafer:

But some are better, some are better in wind, some are better

Xhafer:

for weird angles and stuff.

Xhafer:

Like, like I, I justify each of their places in my bag,

Xhafer:

I also just took out like six because I never throw them.

Xhafer:

So I do that a lot too, where I'll try to pair down and cycle through

Xhafer:

stuff, grab something I haven't thrown in a while off the storage rack.

Laura:

Bring at least one of the windy ones when you come here.

Xhafer:

Yeah, for sure.

Laura:

At least one.

Laura:

Oh hey, speaking of discs, Our episode today opens up with a shot of

Laura:

Babylon five and we got some of those saucer disc kind of ships out front.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

We've got various alien species protecting the station uh, at the start of season

Xhafer:

three, episode 14, ship of tears.

Xhafer:

So yeah, we see the Babylon treaty is in effect now.

Xhafer:

Has the station defense is no longer just some star furries

Xhafer:

and a couple Minbar cruisers.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

I guess these saucers are the ri, I had to google

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Laura:

but the, the RI must be one of the non-aligned worlds.

Laura:

Yes.

Xhafer:

Yeah, so before this we see a few, or after this rather,

Xhafer:

we see a few members of the senior staff watch i s n come back online.

Laura:

yeah.

Xhafer:

They are initially hopeful and that this is a sign that Earth

Xhafer:

might be returning to normalcy because free speech might be back.

Laura:

Yeah, no, Franklin is way too optimistic.

Laura:

He's kind of the Pollyanna leading the, the optimism, and it's too much my man.

Xhafer:

Too much.

Xhafer:

Yeah, this is quickly broken.

Xhafer:

As everyone sees that this isn't news, this is bullshit, and they turn it off

Xhafer:

just like everyone does in real life.

Xhafer:

When they're presented with a news broadcast that gives them

Xhafer:

fake news, they just know it's bullshit and they just turn it off.

Xhafer:

No one buys that.

Xhafer:

This is a completely believable scene.

Xhafer:

That didn't make me upset about real life at all.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

I think that we gotta revisit that one in the reboot, right?

Laura:

and uh, yeah, this lady.

Laura:

She is just so peppy about her bullshit lines and she has a super nineties haircut

Laura:

that I was just like, wow, this this is an interesting show We're watching.

Laura:

I s n is not the same.

Xhafer:

Oh yeah.

Xhafer:

Well, they're just talking about the super popular martial law and decree E.

Xhafer:

Everyone loves it.

Xhafer:

Yep.

Laura:

She may not have said super, but she definitely said popular

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Laura:

in reference to martial law.

Laura:

That is just wild.

Laura:

Just wild.

Laura:

Sheridan is out testing the new star theories that they got from

Laura:

one of the ships that didn't make it outside of the Battle of Babylon.

Laura:

Five, the Churchill.

Laura:

That's it.

Laura:

And while they're out there, we find out that these ones can go in atmosphere,

Laura:

which I suspect we're being told because it's going to be important later.

Xhafer:

Yes, it will be

Laura:

Feels very important.

Xhafer:

it will be important that the same episode, something else that happens

Xhafer:

in this episode is very important for.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

and I can confirm at this point, this was the episode I missed

Xhafer:

in my original viewing as like a young adult child out from the times

Xhafer:

I watched Babylon five growing up.

Xhafer:

This, I never saw this one.

Laura:

that's crazy.

Xhafer:

there's a couple huge plot points in this episode that are so important,

Laura:

And it, it, you know, it at the end we get this cliffhanger that

Laura:

kicks off a whole bunch of stuff,

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Yeah, I mean, most of that, most of the stuff that's super important is like

Xhafer:

followed up on in the next episode,

Xhafer:

There's a couple of pop points that are just left in this episode for next season,

Laura:

mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

I just had no idea what was going on at one point.

Laura:

I'm so sorry.

Laura:

my

Laura:

condolences.

Xhafer:

it is.

Xhafer:

Anyways, children's out getting his flight time and they get

Xhafer:

a distress signal from Baster.

Laura:

dun, dun dun Sheridan recognizes the ship as a black Omega ship.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

He knows this is Cycore.

Laura:

the big thing on the star fury, and he knows exactly how

Laura:

to deal with a black omega ship.

Laura:

You get out of its line of sight,

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

if they can't see you, they can't scan you.

Laura:

He gets close enough to find out who it is, and turns

Laura:

out it's our old pal Buster

Xhafer:

Sheridan's, like, just give me one reason to blow you up.

Xhafer:

Please, please give me a reason to blow you up.

Xhafer:

I'd really like to blow you up.

Xhafer:

Just, just, just say something a little hostile.

Xhafer:

Just please anything.

Xhafer:

investors I like, aren't you curious?

Xhafer:

And he's just like, damn it.

Laura:

Well, now I am

Xhafer:

Right?

Xhafer:

So they bring him back to the station and as they're escorting

Xhafer:

it back to the station, obviously they signal Babylon five.

Xhafer:

Ivan is freaking.

Xhafer:

Rightfully so.

Xhafer:

And, uh, she runs into Ja car after missing a meeting with him earlier,

Xhafer:

and he's tired of getting dodged and left out of the alliance that he knows

Xhafer:

is forming behind his back right now.

Laura:

Yeah, they just sort of put a pin in that and it's been

Laura:

a pin and it's not got anywhere.

Laura:

Uh, We get bester arriving on the station to some armed guards and at this

Laura:

point I was wondering like, shouldn't we be scrambling arm imbar telepaths?

Laura:

Surely there is still some around like

Xhafer:

You would think?

Laura:

but at least we got the SWAT team.

Laura:

I guess that's the best we could do.

Xhafer:

Senior staff meets to go over best's arrival.

Xhafer:

Franklin brings up the good point.

Xhafer:

Like last time he was here, we had like a ton of stuff.

Xhafer:

We were hiding the resistance.

Xhafer:

Any plans for independence The stuff with President Clark, like that's all done now.

Xhafer:

It's all out in the open.

Xhafer:

Like, who gives a fuck if he re scans us?

Xhafer:

Like, what's he gonna find out?

Xhafer:

Nirvana was like uh,

Laura:

We could still have other secrets, dude.

Xhafer:

Garibaldi takes a moment to remind everyone that he's always

Xhafer:

just been in business for himself and that him being there is not

Xhafer:

necessarily a sign of Earth Force, but also is not necessarily a welcome.

Laura:

Right,

Xhafer:

Sheridan asked Siva to be the first to see him since

Xhafer:

she will know if he scans her.

Xhafer:

She's hesitant, but Sheridan promises that if he finds out that she's

Xhafer:

late in Telepath, they will just lock him up and throw away the key.

Xhafer:

So she'll reluctantly agrees.

Laura:

Yeah, I mean he, I hate that he asks her to do this, but at the

Laura:

same time, he has a great point.

Laura:

Like if he's out here, you know, we are independent and he's alone.

Laura:

He came in a single star fury, like

Laura:

what's he gonna do?

Laura:

He can have an

Laura:

accident in his cell,

Xhafer:

I'm surprised she, he's even like, we'll just lock him up.

Xhafer:

It's all like, you're just gonna lock him up.

Xhafer:

You're just gonna shoot his ass.

Xhafer:

Cuz you really wanted to blow him up about 10 minutes

Laura:

Right.

Laura:

.It's a euphemism.

Laura:

We'll just lock him up.

Xhafer:

Oh, okay.

Xhafer:

GE Baldy style.

Laura:

right?

Xhafer:

the commander goes to see ster and he's like immediately the worst.

Laura:

Oh my God, yes.

Xhafer:

Talking about like, oh, you've got your mother's eyes and stuff.

Xhafer:

So she just slaps him and he moves on with why he's there.

Xhafer:

He knows that the shadows are controlling.

Xhafer:

President Clark investors real upfront here, he lays out his ambition.

Xhafer:

Eventually the telepaths are gonna run Earth, they're gonna run humanity.

Xhafer:

But these shadows have other plans for the teps and for Cyco.

Xhafer:

And so the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

Xhafer:

We need to work together to get rid of the shadow.

Laura:

Yeah, this is the first time I had ever heard this saying I, I don't

Laura:

know why I remember it so vividly, but I do, maybe because it comes up

Laura:

again, I think in the Enders game series, you know, the book series and

Laura:

uh, , , it really struck me out that.

Laura:

It came from Ster first in my mind.

Laura:

I know it's much older than that.

Laura:

But yeah, when he's giving her the speech here about, you know, we are

Laura:

the next phase of human evolution, I'm just sitting there going,

Laura:

oh, he didn't read Dark Genesis

Xhafer:

Bester needs to join our book club.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Cuz in Dark Genesis, we.

Laura:

, it was um, some creative evolution.

Laura:

It was influenced evolution.

Xhafer:

Well, and he would, he would probably actually be aware of this

Xhafer:

from the, from the book.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Because isn't he, what's his name's

Laura:

He is what's his name's kid, but I don't know.

Laura:

We're gonna have to read the next book, I guess to find out if he gets any

Laura:

like hints about that.

Xhafer:

Yeah, that book club is in less than 10 episodes.

Xhafer:

We,

Laura:

We do need to start reading that book.

Xhafer:

need to start reading that book.

Xhafer:

I said I need to finish the first one.

Xhafer:

Stone

Laura:

Get on it.

Laura:

Jafa.

Xhafer:

I will try.

Xhafer:

Anyways, after this Len and Sheridan meet up and they own

Xhafer:

up to being shitty to Ja Car.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

being shitty to Olive Narn.

Laura:

they're facing the music that like, they're gonna have to tell

Laura:

him if he really wants in on this, he's gonna have to know the truth.

Laura:

And that's gonna suck and it's gonna be uncomfortable.

Xhafer:

And so Dalen owns it.

Xhafer:

She's like, look, I was part of the Great Council.

Xhafer:

This was also a Minbar government decision.

Laura:

Huh.

Xhafer:

I'll talk to him.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

She doesn't want to

Xhafer:

no, no.

Xhafer:

Sheridan didn't have the authority to act on behalf of Earth.

Xhafer:

You know, Dalen had the authority to act on behalf of Minbar,

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

It sucks.

Xhafer:

Ster reveals he knows of a wet shipment meant for the

Xhafer:

shadows to say weapons components.

Xhafer:

A

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

We talk about weapons a lot and we know in this point of the series,

Laura:

we've, we've seen that, I can't remember what episode it, it was, but

Laura:

you know, a human being merged with a shadow ship was gonna be a thing.

Xhafer:

Yes.

Laura:

I mean

Xhafer:

yeah.

Xhafer:

Anything implied is made explicit soon enough.

Laura:

yeah

Xhafer:

anyways beter also reveals that it's possible for high level

Xhafer:

Telepaths to be able to find ships in hyperspace by listening to the

Xhafer:

voices of the people on the ship.

Laura:

what a wild idea, right?

Xhafer:

I guess hyperspace amplifies the abilities.

Xhafer:

I'm guessing it's just so quiet or the distance is different or

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

I could see it being like a distance folded thing or something, you know?

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

But while they can do this, the military has not been informed because

Laura:

Cycore values, telepath lives too highly to just put them on ships,

Laura:

military ships, to find people.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

We don't want a p cop on every fucking heavy frigate

Xhafer:

having to lit us some normies.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

And he, he makes the, it's the economy stupid argument.

Laura:

That it takes a lot of work to breed one of us.

Laura:

But you guys breed like rabbits, so

Xhafer:

Len starts meeting with Kar here.

Xhafer:

I've read an anecdote from JMS that he left absolutely no

Xhafer:

notes for Mira and Andreas for

Laura:

They didn't need

Xhafer:

No, they didn't.

Xhafer:

He was like, here's your lines.

Xhafer:

You guys understand the weight of everything that you're saying.

Xhafer:

Go act the hell out of it.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

These are two people who understand how to have a difficult conversation

Laura:

and how a difficult conversation goes.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

So this starts, but before it gets really into it we cut to Bester, Lanier,

Xhafer:

Sheridan, and Ivanova on a white star.

Laura:

Yeah, it's real dangerous taking the enemy of your

Laura:

enemy on the white star, but

Laura:

I guess you

Xhafer:

those are still a secret, but we've also seen them out

Xhafer:

on patrol around Babylon five.

Xhafer:

So maybe it's not so much of a secret anymore.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Still, I don't know if I want a P cop on there, but they probably

Laura:

have some Imbar Telepaths to keep him in line on that white star.

Laura:

That's what I

Xhafer:

Probably.

Xhafer:

Yeah, I would think so.

Xhafer:

Uh, Bester sits

Xhafer:

in the chair.

Xhafer:

Fun little bit.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

We all had a good laugh there.

Laura:

Even Owen was like, that was funny.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Walter Connick finally gets to sit in the captain's chair and

Xhafer:

then gets thrown out immediately.

Laura:

But he starts to sense the ship out there in hyperspace.

Laura:

He, he picks something up pretty quickly.

Xhafer:

We see a bunch of the little fighters, but none of the big scary

Xhafer:

shadow ships escorting this thing around.

Laura:

back at the station.

Laura:

Dylan is breaking the bad news.

Laura:

She tells Jaar, you know, the, the gray council ordered me silent.

Laura:

I, I tried, but you know, as a result, the Sonari got shadow help

Laura:

and they destroyed your world.

Xhafer:

Yep.

Laura:

She makes the argument that, this probably saved some narn lives because

Laura:

the shadows were still cloaked and so they didn't scorch the, the whole planet.

Laura:

They didn't scorch the earth with this thing.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

She uses the phrase millions instead of billion.

Laura:

yeah, she says there's still billions of people alive on narn, which

Laura:

seems, I don't know, seems kind of hard to believe after the mass drivers.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

But you kind of expect this to go similar to how Jaar treated Veer when

Laura:

he tried to apologize for everything.

Laura:

When Jaar sliced his hand and the dripping

Xhafer:

da.

Xhafer:

da.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Laura:

But I believe when that happened, he hadn't yet been touched by the VO lawn.

Laura:

Right.

Xhafer:

Yes,

Laura:

So now we have Jaar who's been touched by a Orlon, and he

Laura:

takes it much more gracefully.

Xhafer:

for sure.

Xhafer:

He even says that if he had found this out during the invasion, His anger

Xhafer:

would've led to him killing Dalen.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

But you know, that's that's not him anymore.

Xhafer:

And he recognizes that he talks about his vision and kashas words, even though

Xhafer:

he doesn't know they're kashas words ringing to him that the sacrifice that

Xhafer:

was going to be required was actually speaking about the past and was not

Xhafer:

prophecy about the future necessarily,

Laura:

Yeah, it could be

Laura:

both

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

He ends the conversation saying he doesn't forgive her even though

Laura:

he understands so, but there's no

Laura:

violence.

Xhafer:

the white star, takes out the shadow fighters and they

Xhafer:

capture the freighter very quickly.

Xhafer:

when the crab ship appears and then fucks off immediately,

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

So weird.

Xhafer:

it's just like shimmers in, oh shit.

Xhafer:

Shimmers out.

Laura:

Yeah, the mothership showed up, but then she, she left.

Laura:

She was

Laura:

not interested in the transport anymore, and everyone notes this.

Laura:

We note that this should have been a firefight and it's not.

Laura:

What's the deal?

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

. Laura: So we go back to the station.

Xhafer:

yep.

Xhafer:

And we find that the weapon components are actually cryogenically frozen humans.

Xhafer:

with Cyco iconography all over it.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

They've got like Wires in their heads.

Laura:

We found out that the alien that was piloting the transport, we don't know

Laura:

what it is and he apparently killed himself rather than be captured.

Xhafer:

And with a ton of acid, apparently

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

like, I'm going to melt me.

Xhafer:

You will not be able to identify me

Laura:

yeah, he is unrecognizable and uh, that seems pretty

Laura:

ominous in and of itself.

Xhafer:

Yeah the cargo tubes are brought on board and one is being slowly

Xhafer:

unthawed to determine what happened, and probably too soon given Franklin's

Xhafer:

response, they wake up screaming

Laura:

Oh my God, Franklin is such a dipshit for doing this,

Laura:

like waking this telepath up without another telepath present

Laura:

because we've seen like, Telepaths have freakouts on this show before

Laura:

you

Xhafer:

mind.

Xhafer:

Quakes.

Xhafer:

They're such a thing in the war.

Xhafer:

There's a name for them.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

I mean, I know we don't super tres fester.

Laura:

Maybe we find Lida or get some of the mbar,

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Alita is off station for this.

Laura:

yeah.

Xhafer:

Because she has to be off station next episode as well,

Laura:

Ah, . Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha.

Laura:

But I mean, I know we don't super trust ster, but at this point I would

Laura:

almost rather best her be there,

Xhafer:

yeah.

Laura:

at least if I'm Franklin.

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

they take the bracelet to ster who tells a bit of backstory before identifying who

Xhafer:

this is, and then insisting to see her.

Xhafer:

The sleeping tape has terrible nightmares.

Xhafer:

Then we cut back to the reality and med lab is under lockdown as this

Xhafer:

TE has begun to integrate themselves with the technology around them.

Laura:

She's gone full Borg.

Xhafer:

It's crazy.

Xhafer:

Just I don't know if anyone else is an IT nerd in here.

Xhafer:

There's a lot of just like random cables and cords and stuff, but right by her

Xhafer:

head is what would be it's, they're not used now, but is the old like hard

Xhafer:

drive and disc drive power connector, like little four pin white thing.

Xhafer:

And I just

Xhafer:

saw that and I'm all like, I know that's not Molex.

Xhafer:

I can't remember the name of it, but I was just like, I know that cord.

Laura:

Do we have any IT nerds listening to our Babylon five podcast?

Laura:

Who knows Yeah.

Laura:

I think they did a pretty good job for what they had at the time, you know?

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

It's, it's uh, the shots here are all very dynamic.

Xhafer:

It felt a lot like aliens to me.

Laura:

Yeah, for real.

Laura:

All, all foggy and

Xhafer:

Yeah,

Xhafer:

it was good.

Xhafer:

So she's freaking out.

Xhafer:

She recognizes ster and then shoots some lightning and then

Xhafer:

garabaldi pieces together that she's instinctively attacking the Cyco emblem.

Laura:

Yeah, cuz she seemed to talk friendly to ster, like she

Laura:

seemed fond or at least, you know, familiar and not terrified of ster,

Laura:

but something else freaked her out.

Laura:

Yeah, she called him Al.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Franklin is able to drug her as she shares her pain and visions with ster

Xhafer:

and we learned exactly why the telepaths are considered weapons components.

Xhafer:

They are the shadow ship pilots.

Laura:

Yeah,

Laura:

so back in Sheridan's office.

Laura:

We've given bester a cup of hot cocoa in this wild looking coffee cup.

Laura:

It's not even the standard future coffee cup.

Xhafer:

yeah.

Xhafer:

Oh, the, the metal, the stainless steel one with the handle.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Laura:

the, the flared base at the bottom?

Laura:

Yeah,

Laura:

that's

Laura:

the

Xhafer:

Gino Cups.

Laura:

yeah.

Laura:

The standard Future Cup

Xhafer:

We've got one in the house actually.

Laura:

This one is even more elaborate than that.

Laura:

I, I laughed at this coffee cap, but you know, we got him some hot cocoa

Laura:

cuz he's obviously been rattled by

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Bester needs his hot cocoa.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

He bears his soul and apparently he, he's been in love with this woman.

Laura:

She's supposedly pregnant with his child, which I feel like Franklin should

Laura:

have noticed in his like examination

Xhafer:

Um, I, I was under the assumption that she was no longer pregnant.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

I mean, beter talks about it in the present tense, like

Xhafer:

Yeah, well, she's only been missing for four weeks.

Laura:

yeah.

Xhafer:

we do get a little bit of a timestamp on it.

Xhafer:

But given everything that she was through in those four weeks,

Laura:

Right.

Laura:

Can you cry or suspend a pregnancy like.

Laura:

I don't know,

Xhafer:

I don't if you're those weird aliens and ortho

Xhafer:

shadows, I don't think You try.

Laura:

Yeah, right.

Laura:

That's not what they need her for.

Laura:

Right.

Laura:

. So yeah, I, I think Beter might be in for a disappointment here.

Laura:

Um, But yeah, they've stumbled onto the telepath pilots that were taken.

Laura:

Bester tells us.

Laura:

This lady was a blip.

Laura:

Right?

Laura:

That's his word for a telepath that tried to escape.

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

Someone who went on the run, refused the meds, refused to join the.

Laura:

Right.

Laura:

And he met her, I think when she was in a reeducation camp,

Xhafer:

Yes.

Xhafer:

They say that the one on Mars that Gar balding totally doesn't know exists.

Laura:

right?

Laura:

, yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

So, . The implication here, I guess, is that Cyco is not sending,

Laura:

you know, its loyal telepath.

Laura:

They're sending the expendable ones, the ones that didn't want to be in

Laura:

Cycore, and so we are just gonna go ahead and send them off to become ships.

Xhafer:

Someone did.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Baster didn't like that.

Xhafer:

No, he is not happy.

Xhafer:

He states that their war against the shadows is now

Xhafer:

his war against the shadows.

Laura:

Yeah, I think it's not just this woman, but the idea that, you

Laura:

know, any of his superiorly evolved brethren would be subjected to this

Laura:

even if they didn't wanna join the core.

Laura:

As long as they're, you

Xhafer:

the heirs, you know, they, they will still rule the earth, so

Laura:

As long as they're here, we can fix them.

Laura:

Right.

Laura:

We can make them love cyco.

Laura:

We can make them love their fellow telepath.

Xhafer:

Yeah, they've, they've been brainwashed to some kind.

Xhafer:

How hard can it be to do it twice now?

Xhafer:

Right.

Laura:

Right?

Laura:

Right?

Laura:

But these shadow aliens, taking them away to become weapons components

Xhafer:

Mm,

Laura:

is beneath, beneath their dignity.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Move over to Dylan and Shakar as they head to the War Council and

Xhafer:

we

Xhafer:

get the new War room set.

Xhafer:

. Laura: We must have

Xhafer:

They did?

Xhafer:

Yes.

Xhafer:

This is the first episode it's in.

Xhafer:

Does it feel familiar to you?

Laura:

Oh, you know, I . Don't know.

Xhafer:

This is actually a

Xhafer:

redress of the casino.

Laura:

Oh, we fancied up the casino.

Laura:

Huh?

Xhafer:

Yep.

Xhafer:

When you like look at it now and you see the like angle that they come in and

Xhafer:

there's like that double stairwell when they come in, you'll, you'll feel the

Xhafer:

casino vibes, like it has some of the same spots, like some of the structure

Xhafer:

of it is the same as the casino room, and you'll like, especially think back

Xhafer:

to the big brawl that happened in this.

Laura:

Mm-hmm.

Laura:

. Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

and you'll like instantly all start to click together for you.

Xhafer:

You'll see the whole room.

Laura:

Well, it is a very spacious room when they're walking in.

Laura:

Then they really highlight that about how much space is in there.

Laura:

And so that makes sense.

Laura:

That's probably the most spacious set we've had has been the casino set

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

It's one of the biggest, and they were, they're done with it.

Xhafer:

You know, they're not, we're not having fun times with Lando and

Xhafer:

Linear in the casino anymore,

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Garabaldi goes to Jakarta's book of Jaquan

Laura:

yeah.

Xhafer:

and he's like, he, like, he wakes up in the middle

Xhafer:

of the night or something.

Xhafer:

He's like, there's this passage, right?

Xhafer:

He like, he remembers a thing and he has to find it, and he finds

Xhafer:

something about the mind walkers.

Xhafer:

So he gets the war council together to reveal his findings.

Xhafer:

The telepaths are the key to driving off the shadows.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

This is.

Laura:

Do not thump the book of Jaquan moment.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

I, I'm sure that that, uh, Garabaldi stumped on his share of Bibles.

Laura:

I ironically, not so much like, seriously, you know, it's not

Laura:

a Bible thumper, but yeah.

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

. So there's one little bit here and.

Xhafer:

Which is the shadows, attack precarious space openly,

Xhafer:

thus beginning the Great War.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

And

Xhafer:

that's the episode.

Laura:

why do you think that they attack the becu openly now?

Xhafer:

I think that they can't, they don't feel they can wait

Xhafer:

anymore because of the telepaths.

Xhafer:

It's that shadow ship felt

Xhafer:

fester.

Xhafer:

It was all like, oh, fuck . They, they figured it out.

Xhafer:

We've fought these things three times now and they've never had a telepath like this

Xhafer:

on board, and now now we've got a problem.

Laura:

And they stole our ship of

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

The hundred pilots, a hundred crab, less crab ships running around.

Xhafer:

That might have been.

Xhafer:

,they might have been able to handle the telepathic assault because that's what

Xhafer:

they think they want the telepaths for.

Laura:

Mm-hmm.

Laura:

.Basically, we've adapted this technology that was used against us

Laura:

to help defend ourselves.

. Xhafer:

Yep.

. Xhafer:

Now we know that Telepaths can mess with the connection between

. Xhafer:

a shadow ship and its pilot.

. Xhafer:

When, and this one just fucks off when it sends Bester, who is a P 12?

Laura:

Pretty strong.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

I read a very interesting theory about the first time a white

Xhafer:

star fights a shadow ship, which is Ivanova was on the ship, right,

Laura:

Oh, she was,

Xhafer:

and they weren't able to hit the ship.

Xhafer:

They fired a bunch at it, but they never hit the white star.

Xhafer:

In their next encounter, Ivanova not on the ship, they were

Xhafer:

able to hit the white star.

Xhafer:

So the fan theory is that her latent telepathy was just enough to

Xhafer:

confuse the pilot and kind of make the ship very hard to hit for them.

Laura:

That is an interesting theory because we don't know if ster actually

Laura:

actively did anything to that shadow

Laura:

ship.

Laura:

It.

Laura:

It seemed like if he, if he was doing something that the story would've told us,

Laura:

like he would've said, I did something.

Laura:

He didn't.

Laura:

Indicated anything because at the end he's not really holding back from the

Laura:

Babylon five command staff anymore.

Laura:

He's, he wants the shadows gone out of his telepaths

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Laura:

and uh, if he had done something, he probably would've said so.

Laura:

He , he's not a modest man.

Xhafer:

No.

Xhafer:

No.

Xhafer:

If, if the senior staff owed their lives to him, he would make sure they knew it.

Laura:

right.

Laura:

So if just the presence of the telepath is enough and just even a not fully

Laura:

developed telepath, like Ivanova was able to disrupt the shadows in some way.

Laura:

That's a big thing.

Laura:

That's big.

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

So Js actually spoke on this and was like uh, quit incidents,

Xhafer:

not really what I was going for.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Okay.

Xhafer:

But it does check out.

Xhafer:

But the, I think he mostly was saying this so that there was not

Xhafer:

any like, well, AFA means they can't hit the white star like the telepath.

Xhafer:

Having a telepath on a ship means it's invincible because

Xhafer:

that removes all the stakes.

Laura:

it.

Laura:

It does.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

So I feel like that's the reason why and it kind of checks out, but also

Xhafer:

if the, the shadow ship was unaware, it kinda, it fits nice, you know?

Laura:

Yeah, it is a nice like idea,

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Laura:

even if it is just coincidence,

Xhafer:

All right, Laura, on a scale of Babylon's one to five,

Xhafer:

how'd you feel about this episode?

Laura:

man, I, I have no complaints about this episode.

Laura:

I have nothing that I would change.

Laura:

I know I just gave a really silly episode of Babylon five, but.

Laura:

I kind of think this is another five for me.

Xhafer:

this is a really good app.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

I do feel like it felt rushed, not, not like the

Xhafer:

pacing, not the production.

Xhafer:

. It felt very like, here's the thing, here's the thing.

Xhafer:

Here's the thing, here's the thing, here's the thing, here's the thing,

Xhafer:

here's the thing, here's the thing.

Xhafer:

Credits to me, and when I see an episode like that, especially on a show that

Xhafer:

is capable of slowing down and doing it well, like this show is shown, it makes

Xhafer:

me kind of wish this was a two-parter.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Well, and it, it feels like we are leaving it on a cliffhanger, so why not stretch

Laura:

that a little differently, you know?

Xhafer:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

I mean, if we could like get rid of, I don't know, exogenesis and

Xhafer:

had a two-parter here instead,

Laura:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

I'd like this more.

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

But it's a great app.

Xhafer:

I put it at a four outta five.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

I, I wondered when this episode ended.

Laura:

because I don't really remember getting more than like one ster episode at a time.

Laura:

But you almost feel like he's not left yet, like he

Laura:

should be in the next episode.

Xhafer:

Mm.

Laura:

I haven't watched the next episode yet,

Laura:

so I'm like, I don't, I don't think he is.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

But you're right.

Laura:

That's, that's one of those things that feels a little rushed.

Laura:

we get a dramatic statement from Veer, but we don't get a dramatic exit from

Laura:

Veer.

Xhafer:

Yeah, he just kind of leaves quickly and on his own terms,

Laura:

Yeah.

Xhafer:

But he's not in the next episode.

Xhafer:

But next episode is season three, episode 15, interludes and Examinations.

Xhafer:

The Shadows Punish Lando.

Xhafer:

Franklin's drug dependence affects his job performance.

Xhafer:

The death of an ally Marsh Sheridan's momentary victory over the shadows.

Laura:

Whoa.

Laura:

That sounds like another, a lot of things.

Xhafer:

It . Is, it is maybe the most important episode of season three.

Xhafer:

In terms of story

Laura:

Oh boy.

Xhafer:

on the list for sure.

Xhafer:

It's a good one.

Laura:

I mean, there's a lot of them.

Xhafer:

It's one of those jms, like innocuous title, false sense of security,

Laura:

Uhhuh

Xhafer:

but we'll talk about that more next week.

Xhafer:

Until then, we'd like to thank Jeremy Siegel.

Xhafer:

Thank you for our lovely theme music.

Xhafer:

Jeremy, you can find more of Jeremy's work at Jeremy Siegel 42 dot Bandcamp.

Xhafer:

Do.

Laura:

And also thank you to Angry Deck Time Machine on

Laura:

Instagram for our podcast artwork,

Xhafer:

Thanks to our editor, Aaron, for enabling our podcast to be listened.

Xhafer:

Uh, We really appreciate it.

Xhafer:

And all the work you put in

Laura:

And thank you to you, the listener, for being here.

Laura:

If you wanna hang out with us, you can come join the Discord.

Laura:

We have a Discord group.

Laura:

You can get that by emailing.

Laura:

Who are you?

Laura:

B five gmail.com.

Xhafer:

Mm-hmm.

Xhafer:

. Or on the Facebook where we'll answer you quickly.

Xhafer:

And the Twitter, which I check once a week just to see if someone's lit.

Xhafer:

The League of Not Aligned Podcast Signal

Laura:

Yeah.

Laura:

, we'll answer you eventually on Twitter,

Xhafer:

All right, well have a good week.

Xhafer:

Internet.

Laura:

right.

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About the Podcast

Who Are You?
A Babylon 5 Watchcast
Join Laura and Xhafer, two internet strangers as they get to know each other while making jokes about one of their favorite TV shows from their childhood, Babylon 5.