Episode 149

full
Published on:

6th Nov 2024

The Lost Tales - Big Mandela Problems

Join Laura and Xhafer, two internet strangers, as they get to know each other while making jokes about one of their favorite TV shows from their childhood, Babylon 5.

Laura and Xhafer reach the edge of the rim, reviewing the last piece of media in the B5 universe, Babylon 5: The Lost Tales.

Transcript
Laura:

Hello and welcome to Who Are You?

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We're the Babylon 5 watch cast that's

about to not be a Babylon 5 watch cast.

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This is my last time saying it.

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By a couple of former strangers

who are now friends who got to

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know each other over one of their

favorite shows from their childhood.

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Babylon 5.

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I'm Laura.

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I

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Xhafer: And I'm Ja'far.

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Laura: can't believe

that's the last one for me.

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You get the next one.

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Yeah.

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Xhafer: Yeah, I'll take the next one.

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I think I took the first one.

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I don't remember.

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Laura: Yeah, maybe.

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I don't know.

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We've been as equitable as we could.

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Xhafer: Yeah, we definitely

tried to, to split it up a bit.

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Who do you, well, it would be

whoever did the first, who are you?

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The other person would have done the

intro because we always tried to trade

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it when it was a one of us centric intro,

the other one would always bring us in.

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Laura: That's right.

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Yeah.

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Xhafer: so I just blew someone's mind.

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Someone's listened to all of

this podcast and never caught

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Laura: Not noticed it?

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No.

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Xhafer: Right.

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Laura: But then sometimes

we have special one offs.

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You know, guests and

weird things that we did.

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So,

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Xhafer: there's, there's

a lot of stuff in between.

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Um, we, we did try to be

very equitable with it.

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Um, just like, I hope people

tried to be equitable with

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their viewings of the Lost Tales.

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Laura: Yeah.

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That's, so the last piece of artwork

in this series is Babylon 5's The Lost

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Tales, at least as far as we're doing.

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We're not doing like all

the, all of the books and

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Xhafer: Now, if we, if we go back,

um, it will be because there's

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something new or we set up a Patreon

and wanted to read a book or something

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or talk about something else.

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This will be the last of our

regularly scheduled Babylon 5

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series coverage, universe coverage.

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And we will get super emotional

about that next episode.

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Laura: time.

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Not this time.

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Yeah.

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Xhafer: recording the back to back.

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So I think we're we both came with a

mindset thinking of a lot of that stuff.

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I know I've been thinking about

what I would want to say and things.

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So I imagine we'll be kind

of sappy because of that more

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so than a normal episode.

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Also, we're recording at a

really weird time for us.

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Laura: Mm hmm.

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Xhafer: Your new student

laissez faire lifestyle

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Laura: Oh yeah, sure.

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Xhafer: worked 40 something hours this

week already, despite it being Thursday.

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I think I'm at like 43, 44

hours on the clock right now.

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I'm going to be taking a half day today.

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So it's the like middle of a day,

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Laura: Yeah.

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So weird.

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Xhafer: of the middle of the

day of a work, a weekday.

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It's also Halloween today.

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Laura: Oh yeah.

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Happy Halloween.

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Xhafer: Halloween.

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Happy Diwali.

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We don't have a lot of subscribers in

India, but very few listens from that

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country to our podcast, but happy Diwali.

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And then also it's a Samhain,

obviously, cause it's Halloween.

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So a whole bunch of stuff.

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It's a fitting day to talk

about this first Lost Tales.

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Laura: Yeah, for sure.

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Very big spooky vibes

in the first Lost Tales.

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I just want to say, up top.

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it's a lot of fun.

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That I had big Mandela effect

problems with the Lost Tales.

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I don't know what I thought the Lost

Tales was about, but this was not it.

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Xhafer: All I remembered was Sheridan

and Galen talking at the end.

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Laura: Honestly, I didn't

even remember Galen.

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I had like, in my head that there

was some kind of Sheridan and

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Kosh situation, just like a turtle

Kosh suit, like the beginning.

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I.

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I don't know what was going

on in the old brain there.

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And I thought there were

three of them, not two.

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I don't know

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Xhafer: There originally was

supposed to be three, and there

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are three people on the cover.

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Laura: It's that.

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It's that did it to me, I'm sure.

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Xhafer: Yeah, there was supposed

to be one with Garibaldi that was

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gonna be much more effects intensive.

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Um, and they were all supposed to be

like little 25 minute, 30 minute things.

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And then they cut the Garibaldi

one and expanded these out

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to almost 45 minute episodes

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each,

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Laura: Yeah.

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Xhafer: but close.

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Um, okay.

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So we are in, we started at 2281.

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And we get the effects budget, the

show wishes it had, we get this

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gorgeous shot of Babylon five exploding

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Laura: For real.

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Yeah.

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Like the CGI in this, I thought,

I don't know why, I thought

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the Lost Tales looked bad.

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Because That CGI was really good.

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Xhafer: it's CGI is so much

better than I remember in this.

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And I don't know if it's because

we just watching crusade,

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Laura: Yeah,

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Xhafer: um, but that was

a whole thing with this.

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Although there were people at the

time complaining that the CGI was bad.

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I read a thread on midwinter that

was a bunch of people complaining

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about the CGI of Lockley's quarters.

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That was a real set.

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There was

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not CGI involved in that.

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Laura: Yeah.

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I mean, maybe it wasn't quite

like her original quarters.

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I do feel like some of the set was just

like slightly different that, you know,

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probably they didn't have the original,

so they were just doing their best.

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But that didn't bother me.

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I think.

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The thing that made me think,

oh, the CGI in Lost Tales is

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bad, is the green screening.

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Xhafer: There's a ton of green screening.

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Laura: That is not good.

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Xhafer: The green screening is not great.

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Um, I have to think though, all

the models, like if you, like when

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we talk about how CGI works from a

modern standpoint, it's not great.

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And it would have been done in this

method for this show for lost tales.

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I have to believe where it's,

you have assets and you reuse

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them a bunch and stuff, right?

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So you build a very high detailed

model of Babylon five, and then you

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can reuse it as much as you want.

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Right.

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Laura: Sure.

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Mm

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Xhafer: Stuff like that.

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Um, this is, I mean, this is how CGI

was done in the movies at this point.

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I remember Star Trek 2009, there

was a whole really good documentary

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on the DVD set about it, the

Blu ray set, whatever it was.

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So a lot of this stuff hypothetically

could still exist like the digital assets.

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Hopefully they weren't lost.

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They probably have been.

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Uh, But you could take something like this

and just move everything over to a modern

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3d rendering engine, like unreal five.

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And all it would do is update how the

lighting works and how a handful of the

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like interactions between objects work.

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And it would look like a modern TV show.

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No doubt.

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Laura: Yeah.

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Xhafer: It would look great.

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And even the green screening,

they, I mean, that was the way

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you did these things at that time.

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Nowadays, you have those stages that are

the green screen where it's rendering

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in the background for the actors to

actually be able to look and interact

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and you're filming on it and stuff.

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Laura: That would be so cool.

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Xhafer: I can't, I have to imagine

that style of production for this type

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of thing would have looked seamless.

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It would have looked great.

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Laura: Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Those green screens had to be it

that distracted me because they were

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so noticeably, like, not active.

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Xhafer: The, like the

cutting around the actors,

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Laura: Yeah.

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Xhafer: was like a little bit

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Laura: like an edge.

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Mm hmm.

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Yeah.

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Just really distracting.

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Xhafer: Especially at this time frame.

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Okay.

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So we 2281 station blows up.

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We rewind to 2271 to catch

us up objects and rest.

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Objects in motion and the road home

:

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So it's been four years since crusade.

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The drug plague has ended

sometime in that timeframe.

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Laura: Okay.

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Yeah.

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Xhafer: Lando and Jakar kill each other.

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December 24th, 2278.

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Laura: So that has not happened yet.

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Xhafer: Correct.

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That is seven years in the future.

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Sheridan dies January 20th.

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2281.

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Laura: Yeah.

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And I think we specifically say

that this is 10 years in, right?

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When we get to Sheridan's.

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Yeah.

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Xhafer: Yeah.

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Well, that's why we, cause he dies when

the station blows up because poetry,

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Laura: Yes.

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Of

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Xhafer: So, we're in that timeframe in

between we're post crusade, we're pre all

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of the other future stuff that we've seen.

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So we're in this kind of like amorphous

area and we start with a tale that takes

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place with Lockley and father Cassidy.

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Laura: Did you wish this was Brother Theo?

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Xhafer: wish this was Theo so bad.

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This would have been so good for

Theo coming back to the, the show.

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And even the dialogues, very

Theo esque Cassidy's dialogue.

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maybe, I mean, there's an argument to

be made to not make it Theo because

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of the struggle that the priest

has with his faith a little bit.

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I don't think that's something that

that that'd be a harder time for

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me buying that from Theo, given

all of our interactions with him.

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I feel like he's very, eh.

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Does the thing, um, maybe to the

detriment of the plot, because if there

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isn't that stall time that unluckily

can't figure it out as it were, um,

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Laura: yeah.

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Xhafer: but man I want to like run through

the synopsis of this for our listeners.

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Cause I'm guessing there's people,

especially if you are a modern Babylon

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five watcher, this is like lost media.

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I have no idea how you watched this.

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Laura: It is available on, um, Apple TV.

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Yeah.

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Xhafer: Um, it's not on

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Laura: have to pay for

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Xhafer: things.

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Yeah.

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Laura: Nobody's streaming this.

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Xhafer: Well, you can't even

like buy it on YouTube or

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like, uh, whatever it is now.

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It used to be Flickster, um, Voodoo.

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Right, so whole thing anyways

it's difficult to watch.

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So I want to make sure we do a pretty

good job of synopsis thing to plot because

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I'm guessing people haven't watched

this in a long time if they have or they

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Laura: Yeah.

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Or they have big Mandela problems like me.

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Xhafer: Yeah, but I really want to talk

about this chunk of this episode of

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Laura: Yeah, sure.

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Xhafer: first episode.

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So, uh, they're not titled in

the, in the production, but the

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two names of these mini episodes

are over here and over there.

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Laura: Yeah.

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Voices in the dark over here and over

there is what Wikipedia is showing

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me, but I don't think that was

anywhere within the actual episode.

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Yeah.

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Xhafer: but that that's

what they're called.

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So, uh, we get a little little

bit with Lockley meeting father

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Cassidy luckily got promoted.

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Colonel not captain

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Laura: I did notice that.

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Good for her.

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Xhafer: Lockley talks to

the father in her quarters.

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After he lands, the father waxes poetic on

the natural decline of faith when humanity

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went to the heavens and found them empty

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Laura: Yeah.

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JMS is going through something

and writing this one, right?

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Xhafer: for sure.

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Like,

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I don't know.

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I I'm, I'm the, I'm the wrong

person to ask this question.

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And I'm the wrong person to ask

this question to, um, do people

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think heaven is like physically up?

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Laura: Like, in space?

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Yeah.

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I, I, that feels kind of like

maybe a, um, disingenuous read on

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religious people by an atheist?

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Xhafer: Yeah, that's

what it felt like to me.

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Like, I mean, I went to a Catholic

school you know, for a bit,

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I've had some experience with

the church and the religions.

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Um, I'm not like coming at

this completely out of nowhere.

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I had always assumed, even as a very

small child, heaven was metaphorically

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up and hell was metaphorically down,

not physically, and that's, of course.

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Right?

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Like that's science, like space,

like I had never thought this is

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up for debate and then it's like,

okay, is that just like a product

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of growing up post space age?

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Like now that we've, now that we've gone

up and we've dug down, is this the natural

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consequence of that kind of thinking of

living in a world where we, you know,

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space was achievable before I was born?

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Laura: Yeah.

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Xhafer: So is that just the

zeitgeist has morphed this idea?

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I

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Laura: Like when, when JMS was growing

up, was that a very, very common

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assumption that heaven was in space?

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I don't know.

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I don't know.

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It didn't feel very, like, charitable.

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Xhafer: It did not.

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No, it felt downright talking

down to people of, of faith and,

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Laura: Felt like, look

at these stupid rubes.

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Xhafer: right.

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Exactly.

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Like, well, once, once they got into

space and found out heaven, wasn't

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just a period that we pierced through.

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It was only a matter of time

for people to stop believing.

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It's just like, no one

actually thought that right.

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Like, I'm sure there are people.

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I'm sure they're

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Laura: Well, yes.

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Xhafer: especially

historically speaking, pre.

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Education times.

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I'm sure there were people that

believed heaven was physically up

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and hell was physically down and

that if you were to build a tall

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enough of a staircase, you could you

could climb the stairway to heaven

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Laura: I was gonna make

that joke, god damn you.

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Xhafer: lick.

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Oh, it's so good.

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You know, or if you were to dig deep

enough, hypothetically, you'd reach hell.

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Like, I'm sure there are people that,

that truly believe that with all their

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heart, but I don't think they were

someone who was even remotely educated

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in a way that we would consider to

be acceptable by modern standards.

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Um, and that's, and I'm not trying

to fault anyone there either.

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Like, there's plenty of reasons

to not have an education.

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I'm speaking with a ton of privilege.

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I recognize that.

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Laura: Mm hmm.

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Mm hmm.

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But

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Xhafer: but generally speaking.

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Laura: it did have a tone about

it that felt a little like, okay.

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Xhafer: Yeah, it was, I thought

it was a bit much and, and I've

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gotten no skin in that game.

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Laura: Yeah.

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Xhafer: Lockley and the father

share a great line about going

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to church via guilt or via faith.

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And they're not really

being a distinction.

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I have had this conversation with

friends who are more religious people.

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Uh, it's It's like, I don't know

why I'm going to church anymore.

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And I feel like, dogma Kevin Smith movie.

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Also.

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Had a similar line, um, a little bit.

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I can see this sentiment and I

dunno, like appreciate it, I guess.

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Um, I could, I can understand

that moral quandary.

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do you have, I mean, of the

two of us, you're significantly

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more religious than I am.

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Laura: Yeah.

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I don't know about like how far that goes.

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Like there's a spectrum of significance.

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Right.

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But,

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Xhafer: Well, I it's, I

I'm very on one side, so I

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Laura: yeah.

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Okay.

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Sure.

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Sure.

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I don't know.

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I, I didn't grow up religious at all.

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So really like my mom

is culturally Catholic.

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My dad was culturally Baptist, but

neither of them were like super into it.

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And My like going to church came about

in my college years and then has waxed

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and waned and it's currently in a wane.

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Like, cause everything is hard guys.

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Xhafer: Yeah.

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Well, it's a, it's a time commitment

and I mean, also, you know, faith,

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faith waxes and wanes belief and things

just generally everything is that way.

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All every friendship of significance of

real relationship of significance I've

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had in my life has had ups and downs.

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There's no reason for your relationship

with a religious or spiritual side

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of yourself to be any different.

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Yeah.

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That makes sense to me.

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Laura: And part of like my church

attendance was just like having a

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community that I felt really cool about

and I still respect that community.

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Um, it's just really

hard for me to maintain.

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A community right now, like

be in and a part of it.

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And I feel terrible about that.

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I feel like in a way you guys that

I'm podcasting with are by the

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most community I have right now.

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And I'm really grateful for that.

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But you know,

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I just can't get on board with the whole.

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Organizational church thing, the, the big

thing, like, you know, this father is,

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is I don't know if, does it, they do say

he's Catholic cause they refer he's going

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to go talk to the Holy Father, I think.

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Xhafer: Yeah, they, they make an

oblique reference to the Pope, assuming

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that that hasn't changed too much

in another couple hundred years.

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Laura: No one actually calls, says

the word Catholic, but he's Catholic.

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Xhafer: I mean, there could be

a consolidation of faiths as

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Laura: sure.

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Xhafer: I mean, that's something that,

you know, Empirically, as there are

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less people of certain denominations,

it would make sense to kind of all fold

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in for the strength of the organization.

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Um, I get that.

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Laura: Yeah.

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Yeah.

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The, the, the big organizations I have a

lot less trust with, like, I don't know

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that I could ever fall on board that

hard with a big organization that's, it's

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not really a community anymore then, you

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Xhafer: Mm hmm.

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Laura: It's a business.

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It's a, it's an institution.

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Uh, Just not my style.

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Xhafer: Fair enough.

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Laura: I don't know if that answered

the question you originally asked.

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Xhafer: Not really, but uh, the

question wasn't about an answer.

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It was about having a conversation with

you about your faith and in which case,

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mission accomplished, question answered.

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Laura: All right.

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Good.

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Good.

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I don't feel like I can

answer any questions anymore.

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Like you get into a PhD program and you're

like, Oh, there are no answers anywhere.

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Whoops.

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I didn't want to know that.

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Xhafer: Yeah.

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Uh, Just like our father

might not want to know.

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What he was actually called there for

uh, Lockley reports, strange smells

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sounds, and then asks him if he is

authorized to perform an exorcism.

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And why the fuck do you not get that on

the like letter of travel beforehand?

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Like, we need to send a priest to Babylon

five to investigate something weird.

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And we need to send a priest to

Babylon five to perform an exorcism

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are two different scales of things.

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You can't be surprising

someone with an exorcism.

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Exorcism.

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Laura: I I'm on the one hand, like.

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It feels like you should

lead with that, right?

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But on the other hand, it doesn't

because then you don't get

417

:

anybody because you led with that.

418

:

Xhafer: Mm hmm.

419

:

Hold on.

420

:

Laura: Hot Catholic

421

:

tips coming in, apparently.

422

:

Xhafer: Hot Catholic tips.

423

:

The Pope needs to approve.

424

:

Well, the Vatican does, hypothetically,

the Pope brought to you by Beth.

425

:

Laura: It's his organization.

426

:

That cheeky smile she gave, perfect.

427

:

Yeah, hot news coming in.

428

:

Yeah, I mean, I can see why you don't lead

with that, too, if it's not a big thing.

429

:

You don't get anybody,

they're like, oh, no thanks.

430

:

Xhafer: Yep.

431

:

We get introduced here to Nate Burke

who very quickly plays his hand uh, we,

432

:

there's mentioned of him being alone,

magically covered in blood with no

433

:

cuts and there was no DNA in the blood,

434

:

Laura: Mm, yeah, spooky.

435

:

Xhafer: He's also got the ability

to mystically change the smell

436

:

of the room from I'm guessing

it's supposed to be brimstone.

437

:

They don't really say, but

he makes it smell like roses.

438

:

It's 20 degrees colder.

439

:

Also, Lockly says it's 74,

which means that they're using

440

:

fucking Fahrenheit on Babylon 5.

441

:

I don't know if we caught that.

442

:

That at any point during the

series, if I've already made this

443

:

ridiculous claim, why the fuck are

they using Fahrenheit in space?

444

:

Laura: Man, I love my

Fahrenheit scale, though.

445

:

I don't care about the rest of

the Imperial measurements, but

446

:

Fahrenheit makes sense, god dang it.

447

:

30?

448

:

30 is not a lot of hots.

449

:

Xhafer: make sense.

450

:

Zero and a hundred for freezing

and boiling makes sense.

451

:

Fahrenheit is a fucking wild card.

452

:

Fahrenheit's insane.

453

:

Laura: no, no, no, no.

454

:

So I understand the 0 and 100 for boiling.

455

:

I get that.

456

:

But 100 hots outside is a lot of hots.

457

:

30 hots outside is not a lot of hots.

458

:

Xhafer: if it got to a hundred

outside, there'd be severe problems.

459

:

Laura: be unsustainable hots.

460

:

Yeah.

461

:

Xhafer: Yeah.

462

:

Unsustainable

463

:

Laura: hots.

464

:

Even.

465

:

Xhafer: Um.

466

:

Asmodeus reveals his name here and says

that uh, they want to be exercised.

467

:

Out in space, God had banished demons

to space waiting for humanity to

468

:

reach them to make them not forget

about faith and God and stuff

469

:

Laura: Okay, so most of the

talking from Berk Demon Asmodeus.

470

:

At one point I looked at my watch and

I was like, this has gone on too long.

471

:

Xhafer: it had it did

472

:

Laura: I was like,

473

:

Xhafer: could bloviate normally I'd

say dude could pontificate but that's

474

:

normally a normally a good word very bad

word in this very particular instance.

475

:

Laura: I like Bloviate.

476

:

That's, that's good.

477

:

Xhafer: Yeah.

478

:

Laura: And especially when you, you

mentioned at the top of the show that

479

:

these were originally planned to be

shorter and then blown up a little bit.

480

:

I was like, Oh, that's why I feel like

it's gone on too long because it has.

481

:

Yeah.

482

:

Xhafer: the Sheridan episode after this

could have benefited from like another

483

:

five minutes, you could have done some

interesting stuff in those five minutes.

484

:

You could have had some of Sheridan,

the Prince interacting on the ship

485

:

where he's all like, maybe he's Hitler.

486

:

Maybe he isn't.

487

:

And done some fun things with that

because fun things with, we'll get to it.

488

:

Anyways.

489

:

At the elections next week.

490

:

Anyways,

491

:

Laura: Maybe he's Hitler, maybe he isn't.

492

:

Xhafer: maybe he's healing.

493

:

Maybe he isn't.

494

:

Father Cassidy is not convinced.

495

:

So Asmodeus like surrounds

the station in a ring of fire.

496

:

Laura: Yeah.

497

:

Good effect.

498

:

I liked it.

499

:

Xhafer: his cell just transformed into a

long hell way, a long hallway of hellfire,

500

:

Laura: A hell way, if you will.

501

:

Yeah.

502

:

Xhafer: but it's an illusion.

503

:

The hell way is actually what

I call the 405 in Los Angeles.

504

:

We get a, a posit though.

505

:

Is there a lie in what

Asmodeus is telling them?

506

:

What is the lie?

507

:

And most importantly, why the lie?

508

:

Why though?

509

:

It's if it's a demon, then why the

lie seems pretty straightforward.

510

:

But,

511

:

Laura: I don't think you

need a why, actually.

512

:

Xhafer: yeah.

513

:

As Modius and Cassidy then discuss the

choice between sacrificing the soul of

514

:

the possessed to just, like, let this

dude be a demon forever in order to scare

515

:

people into a religious further, or not

Or exercising him, like, immediately,

516

:

and giving the demon what it wants?

517

:

Laura: Yeah.

518

:

Weird choices.

519

:

Weird choices, all of them.

520

:

Xhafer: Weird choices that line up with my

big problem with this episode as a whole.

521

:

Laura: I can't wait.

522

:

Yeah.

523

:

Xhafer: We're, we're I don't have a

lot of notes on either of these because

524

:

there's so much fucking just wasted

time that it's like, short of recapping

525

:

every line of dialogue, there's not

a whole lot to talk about with this

526

:

episode in terms of the plot and actions.

527

:

Laura: Yeah.

528

:

Lay out the rest of

that plot for us though.

529

:

And then we can critique it.

530

:

Xhafer: Lockley wakes up in the middle

of the night, my notes say it's the hour

531

:

of the wolf uh, well, Lockley starts

to piece it together digging up Burke's

532

:

trip, finds the logs and finds that the

demon was like on the trip the whole time.

533

:

Laura: Mm hmm.

534

:

Yeah.

535

:

The, the crew on the freighter or

liner that he was on were complaining

536

:

about smells and temperatures.

537

:

Yeah.

538

:

Xhafer: So they sedate

Burke and go to talk to him.

539

:

And Lockley uses this to basically solve.

540

:

All of theology demons are real.

541

:

Demons are bound to earth, not hell.

542

:

That's where they were

cast down to hell is earth.

543

:

Laura: Yeah.

544

:

Maybe earth is hell.

545

:

Yeah.

546

:

Yeah.

547

:

Xhafer: The reckoning described at, as

the end of the world in the Bible is

548

:

the death of the sun and exercising the

demon on Babylon five will allow the

549

:

demon to escape the eventual flame out

of the sun and the destruction of earth.

550

:

Leading to an eternity in nothingness.

551

:

So they're sending the demon

back to earth to exercise it.

552

:

Laura: Yeah.

553

:

Xhafer: That's my notes.

554

:

That's where this ends

555

:

Laura: I got like fundamental problems

with The whole demon, and I think

556

:

you do too, in that, like, if we even

accept the premise that demons are

557

:

real and we're sending him back to

558

:

Xhafer: Well, demons are canonically

real in Babylon five now,

559

:

Laura: right, but if, if we accept the

premise of this, why have they not tried

560

:

in the like 200 years we've been in space?

561

:

Before this to leave.

562

:

Xhafer: Good question.

563

:

Laura: But really thought more

564

:

Xhafer: And why is it a suddenly such

a big problem now that luckily has

565

:

to go and tell all of her commander

and captain friends to watch out

566

:

for demons trying to escape earth?

567

:

Laura: yeah.

568

:

Um, and this show has been more of the

like, thoughtful type about these things.

569

:

And I would have expected more

of a, like, Oh, this is a type

570

:

of alien we've never encountered.

571

:

Xhafer: Can I can I improve

this in five seconds for you?

572

:

Laura: Sure.

573

:

Go ahead.

574

:

Xhafer: The dude is a, like, T4,

T5, super low level telepath who

575

:

escaped from a Psi Core facility.

576

:

Laura: Okay.

577

:

Xhafer: That's the only change.

578

:

Laura: Oh yeah.

579

:

Okay.

580

:

I see what you're stepping in.

581

:

Yeah.

582

:

Xhafer: Is he a demon?

583

:

Is this some leftover shit

Bester was fucking with?

584

:

Like, is he making you see

things because he's got some

585

:

weird variant telepath powers?

586

:

Or is this actually happening?

587

:

And leaving it very, very ambiguous.

588

:

Laura: Yeah.

589

:

Xhafer: like Babylon 5.

590

:

This felt like an episode

of The Outer Limits.

591

:

Which I enjoy.

592

:

It's a Twilight Zone episode.

593

:

It has a place in science

fiction for sure, just not in an

594

:

established universe like this.

595

:

There's a reason why those episodes

are so one and done is because they

596

:

want to present ideas that represent

a fundamental change to how we

597

:

view and experience the universe.

598

:

Right, like reality is different

than what you thought it was.

599

:

This is what it's actually going on and

you can do that in a show like once,

600

:

Laura: Yeah.

601

:

Xhafer: right?

602

:

You cannot keep doing it in a same

established universe because at that

603

:

point the universe is just a fun bag

of mysteries, which is cool esque

604

:

like I feel like that's something

Andreas would have gone on about

605

:

in a on a good little monologue

is the word I'm looking for here.

606

:

But that's not Babylon five per se,

you know, we we've had our, this is

607

:

what the universe is actually like,

and that's the Vorlans and the shadows

608

:

fucking with all of the races beforehand,

609

:

Laura: Mm hmm.

610

:

And to that extent, I wanted this

to be like a type of alien who

611

:

had been related to the shadows or

612

:

Xhafer: A hundred percent

makes so much sense.

613

:

Laura: Mm hmm.

614

:

Xhafer: Yep.

615

:

He, he is a shadow sleeper agent that

had contact with a ship or something,

616

:

or some fucking bug crawled down

his fucking throat and messed with

617

:

his brain and gave him pyrokinesis,

618

:

Laura: Yeah.

619

:

Yeah.

620

:

Xhafer: like something, anything

besides demons are canonically real,

621

:

Laura: Yeah.

622

:

It's just rough, especially

to throw that into you.

623

:

a one off several years

after your series ended.

624

:

Xhafer: right?

625

:

It's so fucking weird.

626

:

Okay.

627

:

So.

628

:

We rate episodes of Babylon 5,

if you only listen to our crusade

629

:

coverage, we rate episodes of Babylon

5 on a scale of Babylon's 1 to 5.

630

:

We haven't done this in a little while.

631

:

I'm going to suggest we rate

both of the separate episodes of

632

:

Lost Tales as their own entities.

633

:

On a scale of 5, Laura, how do you

feel about this little mini episode?

634

:

Laura: I was so bored.

635

:

This one, I loved seeing Lockley and

I do even feel like she made like a

636

:

funny reference to her eating habits on

Babylon 5, which gave me a great chuckle.

637

:

But damn, I was just so

bored by this guy and

638

:

Xhafer: Yeah.

639

:

Laura: I, I have to give it like a one.

640

:

Xhafer: I will give it a 1 5, and the 5

is the episode, and the 1 is Lockley's

641

:

like, whatever, I'll fuck up a demon

642

:

Laura: Yeah.

643

:

Xhafer: Like Lockley figures out demons

are real and immediately goes and talks

644

:

it down to its fucking face and says,

you're not gonna win, I'm gonna win.

645

:

That's a point for me.

646

:

Laura: Yeah.

647

:

Can you imagine if the events that

occurred between season four and

648

:

season five hadn't and we still

had Ivanova, her dealing with

649

:

this demon, that'd be fun too.

650

:

Xhafer: That's interesting to be because

Ivanova is a very interesting character.

651

:

Religiously.

652

:

Laura: huh.

653

:

Huh.

654

:

Xhafer: Um, Lockley is kind of

like she, I mean, all we hear

655

:

about it is in this episode.

656

:

It's not an important

part of her character.

657

:

Uh, Ivanova's struggles with her faith

are a important part of her character arc.

658

:

So I would actually be much more

interested in her dealing with this.

659

:

Her and Theo.

660

:

I don't know if it makes it better.

661

:

I don't know if you can make it better.

662

:

You can make it shorter,

which is making it better.

663

:

And I feel like adding Ivanova and Theo

to this and definitely make it shorter.

664

:

Yeah.

665

:

Laura: Yeah.

666

:

I did not remember this at all.

667

:

I was like, what on earth is happening?

668

:

And this guy is talking too long.

669

:

That's the big impressions

I had out of this one.

670

:

Xhafer: All right.

671

:

Well, that was over here.

672

:

It's time to go over there and

talk about our next little.

673

:

Mini episode we cut over to Mimbar

Sheridan is getting a ride to

674

:

Babylon five on the new Valen class

cruiser, by the way, can we talk

675

:

Laura: great.

676

:

Xhafer: it looks so good.

677

:

You remember Legend of the Rangers?

678

:

That was the new Vaylin class

cruiser that got, like, messed up.

679

:

The ship that they didn't get?

680

:

It had the same name.

681

:

Laura: The, the ugly thing.

682

:

Xhafer: yeah.

683

:

Yeah, that ugliest sin box

we saw off in the distance?

684

:

That was, unless I'm

mistaken, I believe it was

685

:

Laura: no, I think you're right.

686

:

Xhafer: cruiser.

687

:

Laura: I think I remember that.

688

:

Hmm.

689

:

What?

690

:

Xhafer: to the well.

691

:

Uh, The ship was so poorly

designed, they completely redid it.

692

:

Yeah.

693

:

Laura: Yeah.

694

:

They were like, oh wait,

all of this is bad.

695

:

Let's do a different one.

696

:

Xhafer: It is kind of like

a space shark kind of thing.

697

:

Laura: Yes.

698

:

I had like whale shark in my head.

699

:

Like, which is nice because the

Minbari are such like angelfish

700

:

ships, the, the white stars.

701

:

So

702

:

Xhafer: Yeah, I dig it.

703

:

Laura: Mm hmm.

704

:

Same.

705

:

Xhafer: where the fuck is Delaine?

706

:

Like, I, I know that you

just don't get Mira, right?

707

:

Laura: Uh Huh.

708

:

Xhafer: Like, I, under, I, I, I

know why Delaine is not in this,

709

:

but like, how the fuck do you do

this story without her, at the very

710

:

least off camera, saying something

like goodbye to him as he leaves.

711

:

Laura: Yeah,

712

:

Xhafer: Right?

713

:

Just give me this much Delen.

714

:

I don't need a lot.

715

:

I can, I can hand wave everything.

716

:

Get Mira on the phone.

717

:

Get her to say her one line.

718

:

Pay her 5, 000 and call it good.

719

:

can't be that hard.

720

:

So anyways, Sheridan's on his trip.

721

:

He's in a conference room that he

jokes about having to add chairs to.

722

:

Laura: okay.

723

:

these chairs, I was just like, man, this

is the set, I think, that got me thinking.

724

:

There was no budget, and this was

so, like, not, I don't want to say

725

:

lazy, but these chairs, I was like,

you, you just, like, pulled these out

726

:

of the, the, WB offices, didn't you?

727

:

Like

728

:

Xhafer: all of the Mimbari internal

ship sets are either super elaborate

729

:

or an excuse to not spend any money.

730

:

There's no middle ground.

731

:

Laura: Mm hmm.

732

:

Yep.

733

:

Doesn't he make a reference

to like, the grey council just

734

:

flies around with no chairs?

735

:

Standing forever?

736

:

Xhafer: They just stand for forever.

737

:

Laura: they're potato sacks, which you

don't have to spend money on either.

738

:

Xhafer: Mm hmm.

739

:

This reporter from ISN Chambers comes in.

740

:

There's our Quintessential

needlessly horny.

741

:

The camera is on my boobs because

the producer said it was a good idea.

742

:

Laura: Yeah That made me tired.

743

:

Xhafer: Yeah,

744

:

it's real.

745

:

Her breasts heaving energy.

746

:

Laura: Uh Huh.

747

:

At least this person is of age.

748

:

But, yeah.

749

:

Exhausting.

750

:

.

Xhafer: Sheridan comments on the loss of who Londo was.

751

:

He talks about how Londo used to

be this, like this boisterous laugh

752

:

incarnate and how that person is dead.

753

:

Londo is still alive, but the

person that Londo was is dead.

754

:

Laura: Yeah.

755

:

We know why.

756

:

We read the books.

757

:

Xhafer: There's talk of

car back beyond the rim.

758

:

This is after a Legend of the Rangers.

759

:

Laura: He, they, they mentioned that

he's gone, gone again, beyond the rim.

760

:

Xhafer: yes.

761

:

So he's, he's come back.

762

:

He's gone again.

763

:

That's because Andreas

had passed away at this

764

:

Laura: And we make a reference to Dr.

765

:

Franklin, went with him.

766

:

Xhafer: Yes Richard bigs.

767

:

I talked about this there, but

Richard bigs passed away during

768

:

pre production of this movie.

769

:

Laura: Oh,

770

:

wow.

771

:

Xhafer: going to be in the movie.

772

:

Laura: Oh,

773

:

that makes me really sad now.

774

:

Was,

775

:

Xhafer: yeah, this would have been

776

:

Laura: he going to be in?

777

:

Xhafer: Um, I assumed

the part three Garibaldi.

778

:

Laura: third option?

779

:

Okay.

780

:

Yeah.

781

:

Xhafer: that they ended up scrapping.

782

:

Laura: I would have preferred

him in the first one even.

783

:

Like, doctor, we need you to look at this.

784

:

Xhafer: That also would

have been interesting to

785

:

Laura: Yeah.

786

:

Anyway.

787

:

Xhafer: Um,

788

:

Laura: so sad.

789

:

R.

790

:

I.

791

:

P.

792

:

Xhafer: They jumped to quantum space,

which seems solely to exist to get

793

:

shared and out of an interview.

794

:

Never mentioned again.

795

:

Laura: And to torture

this poor reporter lady.

796

:

Xhafer: we've got some, we figured

out how to use the glossy and

797

:

blur effect in Photoshop, and

we're just going to turn it up

798

:

to, yeah, slap it all over.

799

:

Exactly.

800

:

Well said.

801

:

After this Galen visits Sheridan in a

dream, showing him New York and ruins.

802

:

He says the city that never weeps.

803

:

Man, that's some post 9 11 commentary.

804

:

Laura: Oh yeah, this would

have been then, wouldn't it?

805

:

Xhafer: Yeah.

806

:

I Look, sometimes Jabez does

something very clever, and it hits

807

:

real fuckin hard, it makes you think.

808

:

And sometimes, he just fuckin whiffs.

809

:

And for me, this line was

just a huge fucking whiff.

810

:

Like, I mean, no one bats a thousand,

like And he's written some really,

811

:

really thoughtful, good shit in his life.

812

:

The City That Never Weeps.

813

:

Five years after 9 11 or whatever?

814

:

Even, even, even now?

815

:

No.

816

:

Like, can't do it, dude.

817

:

Like, I'm not even from there.

818

:

Like, it just seems, it seems

needlessly rude, disrespectful,

819

:

and talking down to people.

820

:

Like other parts of the world.

821

:

Laura: Like other parts

of this one, yeah, yeah.

822

:

And the Galen character often does seem

a little pompous and dark downy, so.

823

:

Xhafer: Yeah.

824

:

Laura: Yeah, its delivery is

825

:

not

826

:

Xhafer: when you're about to

show an attack on New York.

827

:

Like you're literally about to

show New York getting blown up.

828

:

Laura: Uh Huh.

829

:

Xhafer: The city that never weeps.

830

:

Fuck you.

831

:

Laura: Just fuck off

with that a little bit.

832

:

Xhafer: Yeah.

833

:

So he shows Sheridan the attack.

834

:

he, they acknowledged their previous

standing friendship from call to arms.

835

:

Laura: Yeah, which is easy to

forget, like, I almost did.

836

:

Xhafer: Uh, I had to be all

like, wait, when did they meet?

837

:

Oh, that's right.

838

:

Call to arms.

839

:

And then I was reading the wiki Galen was

with Sheridan on Zaha Doom in season four.

840

:

Yeah.

841

:

Yeah, Galen interacts with fucking

uh, Lorian and stuff, whole deal.

842

:

It's all in the book.

843

:

We didn't read the passing

of the techno mages.

844

:

I think.

845

:

Laura: okay, because I was like,

that definitely was never on

846

:

Xhafer: No, it was never on screen.

847

:

It's in one of the books.

848

:

I assume it's in because the passing of

the techno mages is like all about Galen.

849

:

They're Galen books.

850

:

So I assume it's in there,

but man, you know, that's a

851

:

thing.

852

:

Laura: Galen feels kind of like

a character that we're just going

853

:

to retcon him in everywhere.

854

:

Because he is magical and mystical,

and we came up with this good idea,

855

:

like, right there at the end to

have him as a thing, and now we're

856

:

just gonna put him everywhere.

857

:

Xhafer: I just really, it's like, it

feels like everything after Season five

858

:

is just about fucking techno majors.

859

:

All of the books after season

five, the only ones that

860

:

aren't are the Cycore books.

861

:

Everything else has

techno majors all over.

862

:

The fucking Centura Trilogy is a like

solid, like it's 600 pages, I would say

863

:

techno majors around at least 150 pages.

864

:

Of this 600.

865

:

Laura: Yeah, yeah.

866

:

Xhafer: It's like.

867

:

It was a cool idea.

868

:

You had a fun thing in like a

episode of Babylon five, we dug it.

869

:

Techno mages are fun.

870

:

I get it.

871

:

Fucking.

872

:

I don't want all this fucking techno mage

bullshit, especially after a crusade.

873

:

And we find out they're just

the fucking one percenters.

874

:

Laura: Yeah.

875

:

Xhafer: just humans who had enough money

and technology to just live for forever

876

:

and do whatever the fuck they wanted.

877

:

Fuck those guys.

878

:

Fuck those baseless motherfuckers.

879

:

I'm earning our explicit rating today.

880

:

Laura: I mean, why have it

if you're not gonna use it?

881

:

So.

882

:

Xhafer: That I think that's

actually the fun of techno mages.

883

:

I think they're a set

884

:

Laura: I meant the explicit rating,

885

:

Xhafer: Oh Oh yeah.

886

:

Fair.

887

:

Right.

888

:

Got to, got to fucking earn

it every once in a while.

889

:

You can tell I've worked

so much this week.

890

:

I'm so

891

:

Laura: yeah, I think a part of it is like,

maybe JMS felt a profound disappointment

892

:

about not getting to explore the

Technomage stuff farther in Crusade.

893

:

And so we just kept shoehorning it,

retconning it into Babylon 5 everywhere.

894

:

Xhafer: Yeah.

895

:

It's a bit much all around and I just have

my, my tolerance for it is so low at this

896

:

point between the books, between crusade.

897

:

Yeah.

898

:

And now this, I'm so glad there's

no fucking techno majors in

899

:

Battlestar Galactica spoilers.

900

:

Laura: Galen's costume did look great.

901

:

I liked his costume.

902

:

Actually, the costumes in this

one were both, were all great.

903

:

Especially when we get

our Centauri Prince.

904

:

So did

905

:

Xhafer: his outfit's so cool.

906

:

Laura: did you catch his lineage?

907

:

Xhafer: Yeah, this is cart's son.

908

:

Laura: I did not realize

Cartagena had children.

909

:

Xhafer: It's never brought up anywhere

910

:

Laura: Yeah.

911

:

Yeah.

912

:

Xhafer: Even in this Suntory books.

913

:

This, this character does not exist.

914

:

This, this was made after those books.

915

:

Laura: Yeah, which feels weird.

916

:

Xhafer: So Ari here, he's

gonna attack Earth in 30 years.

917

:

He becomes emperor in 20 years.

918

:

Now we did our math at

the start of this episode.

919

:

Veer becomes emperor in seven

years, which means Veer is either

920

:

ousted or killed after ruling the

Centauri Republic for 13 years.

921

:

Laura: Yeah.

922

:

Okay.

923

:

I, could we believe that

maybe he stepped down?

924

:

That seems like a thing Veer could do.

925

:

Xhafer: That seems like a thing

Veer would do a hundred percent.

926

:

Um, but

927

:

Laura: Probably not if this

guy succeeds him though.

928

:

Like in, in the future iteration

that Galen is saying where

929

:

he's a warmongering, you know,

930

:

Xhafer: also Vintari's exact story and

plot are that of Durla in the books.

931

:

He builds a super big fleet

in secret and then attacks all

932

:

these places at the same time.

933

:

Laura: Hmm.

934

:

Xhafer: It's the exact

same thing from the books.

935

:

Laura: It's the Centauri

standard playbook.

936

:

Yeah.

937

:

They're working from.

938

:

Xhafer: Yeah, it didn't work, so they're

gonna try it again 23 years later.

939

:

Veer decommissions all the warships and

then they just start building them all

940

:

over again the second he steps down.

941

:

Laura: Yeah, in secret.

942

:

Xhafer: So yeah, Ventari comes aboard.

943

:

I read that he's channeling

big Cartagena energy.

944

:

I think this actor, this kid, kills it.

945

:

Laura: Mm hmm.

946

:

Yeah, no, I really liked him.

947

:

Xhafer: yeah, there's just

enough not behind the eyes.

948

:

Which is so difficult to do

to make him truly terrifying.

949

:

Laura: Mm

950

:

Xhafer: I believe that this

kid is a genocidal maniac.

951

:

A hundred percent.

952

:

Laura: He's, he's got something

dark that could grow inside him.

953

:

Like he's, he's got a lot of resentments.

954

:

He doesn't have a place to put them.

955

:

He's he's feeling

956

:

very

957

:

powerless.

958

:

Xhafer: He just watched fight

club on repeat for 72 hours.

959

:

Laura: Yeah.

960

:

Yeah.

961

:

This feels like that guy, doesn't it?

962

:

Xhafer: Yeah.

963

:

Having just, I, I think I

mentioned this in this court.

964

:

I finished that podcast earlier today.

965

:

Laura: Yeah.

966

:

I think you've talked about it on POD

before, but what was the name again?

967

:

Xhafer: it's, I don't want to

talk about fight club anymore

968

:

Laura: Yeah,

969

:

Xhafer: and it is fantastic.

970

:

Laura: A journey, I'm sure.

971

:

Xhafer: Yeah, it's really worth your time.

972

:

Like, I would say that if you don't like

fight club, it's a good podcast for you.

973

:

If you're like, I don't want to listen to

someone talk about fight club that long.

974

:

Cause that fuck that movie

975

:

Laura: Yeah.

976

:

This is the podcast for you.

977

:

Yeah.

978

:

Xhafer: This isn't someone who

loves fight club as a grown adult

979

:

watching it because they think

it's the best movie of all time.

980

:

That is not the ride

you're signing up for.

981

:

Laura: Yeah.

982

:

No, I, I definitely thought that

they picked a great actor for this.

983

:

I even Googled him just before this, just

to see like, did he go on and do anything?

984

:

Nope.

985

:

Xhafer: That's a bummer.

986

:

Laura: Yeah, yeah, he must have just

like pulled back completely, but he

987

:

seemed to like do a few maybe in the

90s sort of teen heartthrobby kind

988

:

of things and then was like, nah.

989

:

Well, good for you, Keegan.

990

:

Xhafer: Luckily passes the idea of

Sheridan writing in on a star fury.

991

:

Like it's a good idea and

not a giant security risk.

992

:

Laura: Especially without an EV suit.

993

:

Xhafer: without an Evie suit.

994

:

Uh, He hasn't flown in one in a decade,

995

:

they talk about him like riding in

on the ship that he famously was

996

:

like riding around in the Shadow

Wars, a Starfury and not a white star

997

:

like him coming in on a white star.

998

:

That makes fucking sense.

999

:

Laura: For sure.

:

00:45:05,065 --> 00:45:06,805

Right.

:

00:45:06,865 --> 00:45:08,335

Xhafer: get the hell out of our galaxy.

:

00:45:08,935 --> 00:45:10,525

It all happened on that bridge, right?

:

00:45:11,065 --> 00:45:11,915

All the big moments.

:

00:45:11,915 --> 00:45:14,355

He fucking nuked Zaha

Doom with a white star.

:

00:45:14,555 --> 00:45:17,475

Like, I don't think we saw him

in a Starfury outside of an

:

00:45:17,475 --> 00:45:19,815

excuse to keep his pilot bonus.

:

00:45:22,102 --> 00:45:23,442

This makes no sense to me.

:

00:45:24,732 --> 00:45:28,802

Except you've got a really good Starfury

CGI model and you want to show it off

:

00:45:28,832 --> 00:45:32,782

and it's convenient for the plot to have

him and the prince out alone in space.

:

00:45:34,777 --> 00:45:38,117

Um, we get a, a nod to

Richard Bigg's passing here.

:

00:45:39,157 --> 00:45:43,947

There's a really poignant moment with

Bruce where he just like kind of stares

:

00:45:43,947 --> 00:45:46,457

a little bit off camera and is all

like, we're going to really miss him.

:

00:45:47,227 --> 00:45:52,057

And it just sits there for a moment

because that was super fucking real.

:

00:45:53,352 --> 00:45:55,392

And I'm glad that they

were able to do that.

:

00:45:55,782 --> 00:45:57,792

Cause I'm sure that's, that's

a moment, not just for the

:

00:45:57,802 --> 00:45:59,472

character, but also for the actor.

:

00:45:59,832 --> 00:45:59,992

Laura: Yes.

:

00:46:01,632 --> 00:46:02,342

Very nice.

:

00:46:02,882 --> 00:46:05,672

Xhafer: Galen explains his pot

plot here put Vinatari in the

:

00:46:05,672 --> 00:46:07,312

star fury and then blow it up.

:

00:46:07,862 --> 00:46:12,992

It's really just, you know,

it's a big plot to kill Vintari.

:

00:46:13,531 --> 00:46:19,171

Sheridan sees the war between earth

and the Centauri in his dreams, when

:

00:46:19,171 --> 00:46:23,788

they arrive at Babylon five Sheridan

gets luckily to deliver a second

:

00:46:23,788 --> 00:46:26,288

starfury and tells Intari the good news.

:

00:46:26,288 --> 00:46:28,248

They take them out Ventari.

:

00:46:28,648 --> 00:46:29,658

Talks of his dreams.

:

00:46:29,658 --> 00:46:33,098

He just really wants to make this as

difficult for Sheridan as possible.

:

00:46:33,648 --> 00:46:35,568

And just be all like, is he Hitler?

:

00:46:35,598 --> 00:46:36,918

I don't know the elections in a week.

:

00:46:36,918 --> 00:46:37,598

We'll find out.

:

00:46:38,328 --> 00:46:38,758

Uh,

:

00:46:39,631 --> 00:46:43,731

Laura: I just closed on a house yesterday

and I'm going to propose to my girlfriend.

:

00:46:44,476 --> 00:46:44,686

Xhafer: no

:

00:46:48,697 --> 00:46:51,952

Sheridan recalls his conversations

with Ventari and Galen.

:

00:46:52,612 --> 00:46:57,542

Kills his thrusters, prevents the power

surge, spares Minotauri, and invites

:

00:46:57,542 --> 00:46:59,882

him to come live on Mimbar with him.

:

00:46:59,912 --> 00:47:05,712

And he's going to mentor the Prince so

that he can learn kindness and peace.

:

00:47:06,202 --> 00:47:09,742

Laura: Which is a bold move we

know it worked for Veer really

:

00:47:09,742 --> 00:47:15,062

well, but Veer was also very well

documented as not a normal Centauri.

:

00:47:15,512 --> 00:47:15,872

Xhafer: Yeah.

:

00:47:16,522 --> 00:47:17,222

Laura: Like all the other,

:

00:47:18,202 --> 00:47:22,762

all the other Centauri ambassadors that

have been to Mimbar, like, hated it.

:

00:47:23,142 --> 00:47:26,122

Xhafer: Yeah, there's no

alcohol on the entire planet.

:

00:47:26,555 --> 00:47:26,945

Laura: Right.

:

00:47:27,274 --> 00:47:29,644

Xhafer: Even Galen's like, bro, you sure?

:

00:47:29,824 --> 00:47:32,864

And then Sheridan's like, fucking

kill him in cold blood if I have to.

:

00:47:33,884 --> 00:47:38,154

It's just like, oh, okay, that's going

to be easier for you when he's lived

:

00:47:38,154 --> 00:47:42,584

with your family for years, instead of

now, where he's just a homicidal maniac.

:

00:47:43,294 --> 00:47:47,294

And also, you know, you're clearly so

good at setting your ego and the job that

:

00:47:47,294 --> 00:47:52,379

you do aside, that I believe that you'd

be willing to believe Cause you're going

:

00:47:52,379 --> 00:47:54,549

to die before this kid rises to power.

:

00:47:54,699 --> 00:47:56,739

You know, this, you know,

you've got 10 years left.

:

00:47:56,969 --> 00:47:58,529

You know, he becomes emperor in 20.

:

00:47:58,909 --> 00:48:00,259

This is, these are facts.

:

00:48:00,519 --> 00:48:04,519

Laura: there's, like 50 percent of that

time that you really have no control over.

:

00:48:04,739 --> 00:48:05,169

Xhafer: Mm hmm.

:

00:48:05,529 --> 00:48:07,919

You're going to ask to lend

a fucking kill this kid,

:

00:48:08,530 --> 00:48:11,960

Laura: No, maybe you're, maybe his

you know, I don't know how old the son

:

00:48:11,960 --> 00:48:14,200

is, 16, maybe your 16 year old son.

:

00:48:14,920 --> 00:48:18,340

Xhafer: who just got controlled

and by the fucking keeper.

:

00:48:18,720 --> 00:48:19,180

Laura: Yeah.

:

00:48:19,540 --> 00:48:19,900

Yeah.

:

00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:20,700

That'll go well.

:

00:48:21,260 --> 00:48:21,960

Xhafer: Mm hmm.

:

00:48:22,510 --> 00:48:22,970

Yep.

:

00:48:23,410 --> 00:48:26,190

Laura: I guess he's probably like

20 when Sheridan dies, whatever.

:

00:48:26,500 --> 00:48:26,850

Xhafer: Yeah.

:

00:48:27,777 --> 00:48:32,313

Luckily uh, greets them, takes the

Prince to the party and Galen and

:

00:48:32,313 --> 00:48:34,273

Sheridan put the bow on the plot.

:

00:48:34,863 --> 00:48:36,893

And that's the end of this mini episode.

:

00:48:38,446 --> 00:48:40,772

Laura: Do we want to hop to rating

it or do we want to critique it?

:

00:48:42,865 --> 00:48:45,155

I, I liked this one

better than the first one.

:

00:48:45,155 --> 00:48:47,314

Yeah.

:

00:48:47,330 --> 00:48:49,680

Xhafer: I think this one had a lot

more potential than the first one.

:

00:48:51,250 --> 00:48:53,500

This one asks a more interesting question.

:

00:48:55,210 --> 00:48:58,420

Um, because as Galen posits,

it's all like, Hey, if you had

:

00:48:58,420 --> 00:49:02,250

the chance to kill Hitler when

Hitler was a kid, would you do it?

:

00:49:02,780 --> 00:49:07,995

And that question kind Cannot be

posited without foreknowledge, right?

:

00:49:08,485 --> 00:49:12,725

Cause the answer is obviously no,

unless you know for certain what has

:

00:49:12,735 --> 00:49:15,255

already happened with Hitler, right?

:

00:49:15,845 --> 00:49:20,846

Like you can't ask that of someone

in:

:

00:49:20,846 --> 00:49:22,676

of what's about to happen.

:

00:49:23,316 --> 00:49:23,726

Laura: Mm hmm.

:

00:49:24,261 --> 00:49:28,021

Xhafer: and so the necessity

of that foreknowledge makes

:

00:49:28,021 --> 00:49:29,261

it a foregone conclusion.

:

00:49:29,261 --> 00:49:30,431

That is reality for us.

:

00:49:30,431 --> 00:49:33,791

So it's easy to say, yeah, if I had a

time machine, yeah, give me the option.

:

00:49:33,791 --> 00:49:34,931

I'll go back and kill Hitler, whatever.

:

00:49:34,931 --> 00:49:36,481

I'll save all those people, right?

:

00:49:37,381 --> 00:49:38,981

It's still amorphous here,

:

00:49:39,726 --> 00:49:40,066

Laura: Yeah.

:

00:49:40,831 --> 00:49:44,261

Xhafer: And that's what makes that

question actually interesting.

:

00:49:44,871 --> 00:49:45,871

I think Sheridan.

:

00:49:46,416 --> 00:49:49,436

Comes upon, I don't even want

to say the right answer, but

:

00:49:49,436 --> 00:49:51,046

definitely the most Sheridan answer

:

00:49:51,376 --> 00:49:51,816

Laura: Mm hmm.

:

00:49:52,036 --> 00:49:52,386

Yeah.

:

00:49:52,466 --> 00:49:54,276

He would think he could do this.

:

00:49:54,957 --> 00:49:58,238

Fits fits with the old

patriarchal ego there.

:

00:49:58,598 --> 00:50:02,488

He's going to be a good dad

since he had a crazy dad.

:

00:50:03,838 --> 00:50:05,598

Nurture over nature, guys.

:

00:50:06,078 --> 00:50:06,528

Xhafer: for sure.

:

00:50:06,975 --> 00:50:12,505

there's also like a couple of like weird

unspoken things about it too, where it's

:

00:50:12,505 --> 00:50:18,015

just like, do you really like how much

damage How hurt is this kid already?

:

00:50:18,055 --> 00:50:19,985

How much damage has Vintari suffered

:

00:50:20,465 --> 00:50:24,395

living the life that he's had to

live being the son of a madman?

:

00:50:24,745 --> 00:50:28,135

Why is he in line for the

throne when there is no

:

00:50:28,135 --> 00:50:29,635

established line for the throne?

:

00:50:29,645 --> 00:50:33,590

Because that would imply that, like,

how did Lando and, like, Their entire

:

00:50:33,620 --> 00:50:36,910

like system here doesn't really make

sense to me because when you get

:

00:50:36,910 --> 00:50:40,170

rid of Cartagena, I imagine his son

would have fallen off the block.

:

00:50:40,590 --> 00:50:43,530

Also, why is his son never

mentioned anywhere else?

:

00:50:43,530 --> 00:50:48,620

Because you would think if he

was in line as a heir, that that

:

00:50:48,620 --> 00:50:49,590

would have been a whole thing.

:

00:50:50,020 --> 00:50:50,420

Laura: Yeah.

:

00:50:50,980 --> 00:50:51,640

Xhafer: There's also a

:

00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:52,740

Laura: It should have come up.

:

00:50:53,005 --> 00:50:57,175

Xhafer: That Cartagena is the

nephew of Turin, the emperor

:

00:50:57,175 --> 00:50:59,195

that dies early in Babylon five.

:

00:50:59,485 --> 00:51:01,355

Did we know that beforehand?

:

00:51:02,081 --> 00:51:02,211

Laura: I

:

00:51:02,211 --> 00:51:02,821

don't know if we

:

00:51:02,896 --> 00:51:04,306

Xhafer: that and I could have

:

00:51:04,411 --> 00:51:07,721

Laura: I do feel like

there was talk early on.

:

00:51:08,166 --> 00:51:11,756

When all that was happening of like,

Oh, we're going to prop up this

:

00:51:11,906 --> 00:51:16,156

crazy nephew or something for, for

now, while we run the government.

:

00:51:17,076 --> 00:51:20,706

And then Cartagena turned out to

actually be like a really bad man.

:

00:51:21,676 --> 00:51:22,696

I think so.

:

00:51:22,696 --> 00:51:24,516

I think I do remember

something about that.

:

00:51:24,516 --> 00:51:27,086

Yeah.

:

00:51:27,316 --> 00:51:31,486

Xhafer: my biggest problem with the

lost tales in general, in which it

:

00:51:31,486 --> 00:51:36,916

is clearly written by someone who

remembers 75 percent of their universe.

:

00:51:37,941 --> 00:51:46,486

And it's just scrambling and that hurts

uh, that it's, it sucks because I know

:

00:51:46,486 --> 00:51:50,876

that, like, even with like wrote home,

like, clearly, there is still good

:

00:51:50,876 --> 00:51:53,076

ideas for Babylon five in his mind.

:

00:51:53,636 --> 00:51:55,856

There's still a purpose to this universe.

:

00:51:56,476 --> 00:51:58,136

Um, but like this.

:

00:51:58,571 --> 00:52:04,171

Like, the Centauri books, like

Crusade, like Call to Arms, like

:

00:52:04,511 --> 00:52:07,495

Third Space, like Reversals.

:

00:52:08,165 --> 00:52:13,268

Everything outside of the main show

only subtracts and it doesn't add.

:

00:52:14,688 --> 00:52:15,178

Laura: Yeah.

:

00:52:15,218 --> 00:52:17,431

It, It doesn't feel as well thought out.

:

00:52:17,431 --> 00:52:22,111

We know he had like a great

grand plan for everything.

:

00:52:22,171 --> 00:52:25,521

And some of this stuff just feels

like tacked on like sticky notes.

:

00:52:25,531 --> 00:52:27,141

Well, what if this, what if that, like

:

00:52:27,146 --> 00:52:27,606

Xhafer: Mm hmm.

:

00:52:28,601 --> 00:52:34,455

Laura: instead of the way he meticulously

designed a lot of the show proper.

:

00:52:34,930 --> 00:52:35,350

Xhafer: Yeah.

:

00:52:35,710 --> 00:52:38,020

And it's so much of it just

feels exactly like that.

:

00:52:38,020 --> 00:52:38,550

Sticky notes.

:

00:52:38,550 --> 00:52:41,290

That's a great, that's a great comparison.

:

00:52:41,510 --> 00:52:44,720

Um, it's just, it's stuff that's

just tacked on that doesn't belong.

:

00:52:45,910 --> 00:52:52,180

It sucks because it does, it does, it

does actively subtract from my genuine

:

00:52:52,180 --> 00:52:54,130

feelings of how great the show is.

:

00:52:55,060 --> 00:52:59,730

Laura: I'm very distracted by, you know,

we know we have the canon of the Centauri

:

00:52:59,730 --> 00:53:02,520

dream about their futures and such.

:

00:53:02,860 --> 00:53:09,880

and we know he's dreamed about being

in the star fury, but how, how does

:

00:53:09,900 --> 00:53:12,760

Galen have this glimpse into the future?

:

00:53:12,900 --> 00:53:18,645

Like, is this a, replicatable technology,

:

00:53:19,755 --> 00:53:22,545

Xhafer: I think he's just

fucking with dreams like he do.

:

00:53:23,465 --> 00:53:24,015

Laura: Okay.

:

00:53:24,515 --> 00:53:26,775

Xhafer: And he's just leaning in.

:

00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:28,870

I don't know.

:

00:53:29,570 --> 00:53:33,400

Laura: Yeah, like he's like he's

able to observe people's dreams

:

00:53:33,400 --> 00:53:37,820

and he's seen Vintari's dreams So

he's got to do something about it.

:

00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:41,290

Hmm Okay,

:

00:53:43,468 --> 00:53:43,838

Xhafer: Yeah.

:

00:53:44,578 --> 00:53:48,628

Laura: I really want to like Galen

but he is almost a little too much You

:

00:53:48,628 --> 00:53:50,438

know, like when you create the wizard

:

00:53:50,918 --> 00:53:51,288

Xhafer: Yeah,

:

00:53:52,358 --> 00:53:55,903

Laura: they gotta have They

got to have some weak spots.

:

00:53:56,397 --> 00:53:58,327

They can't be the all powerful wizard.

:

00:53:58,695 --> 00:53:59,265

Xhafer: for sure.

:

00:53:59,857 --> 00:54:07,064

it's just he goes from someone who's like

a conjurer of cheap tricks to Gandalf

:

00:54:07,529 --> 00:54:07,909

Laura: Yeah.

:

00:54:08,822 --> 00:54:10,402

Xhafer: very, very quickly.

:

00:54:11,117 --> 00:54:15,097

And it's kind of jarring in a not fun way.

:

00:54:15,797 --> 00:54:16,467

I don't know.

:

00:54:16,467 --> 00:54:19,534

It's, I don't mean anything against

uh, Peter Woodward either, who

:

00:54:19,534 --> 00:54:20,514

does a great job with what he's

:

00:54:20,599 --> 00:54:21,589

Laura: No, no, no.

:

00:54:21,589 --> 00:54:21,879

Yeah.

:

00:54:21,879 --> 00:54:24,189

He's, he's a fantastic wizard for

:

00:54:24,354 --> 00:54:28,194

Xhafer: It's, it's just like,

if I were playing D and D and

:

00:54:28,194 --> 00:54:29,734

someone rolled Galen at my table.

:

00:54:30,609 --> 00:54:33,349

And I know Ben's gonna do this to

fuck with me for my next campaign,

:

00:54:33,349 --> 00:54:35,919

which is why I'm banning wizards

on my next campaign right now.

:

00:54:39,009 --> 00:54:40,169

I would just be livid.

:

00:54:42,029 --> 00:54:42,449

Laura: Yeah.

:

00:54:42,998 --> 00:54:44,418

Xhafer: It's like, you

can't know everything.

:

00:54:46,358 --> 00:54:52,763

part of what being A interesting character

in a story is, is being fallible and

:

00:54:53,178 --> 00:54:53,238

Laura: Yeah.

:

00:54:54,243 --> 00:54:59,243

Xhafer: Galen's not even, even when

Galen fucks up, he's instantly forgiven

:

00:55:00,384 --> 00:55:00,534

and

:

00:55:00,589 --> 00:55:01,819

Laura: as happened in Crusade.

:

00:55:02,799 --> 00:55:08,319

And he's motivated by a one dimensional

death of the female partner.

:

00:55:08,619 --> 00:55:16,049

And yeah, it's, you know, we all have

limited time and the creators doing the

:

00:55:16,049 --> 00:55:17,819

best they can with what they got, I guess.

:

00:55:18,971 --> 00:55:19,721

We didn't rate it.

:

00:55:19,751 --> 00:55:21,161

We didn't actually put a rating on it.

:

00:55:21,326 --> 00:55:22,486

Xhafer: No, we didn't.

:

00:55:22,576 --> 00:55:24,567

Uh, Two and a half.

:

00:55:25,302 --> 00:55:25,722

Laura: Mm-Hmm.

:

00:55:26,962 --> 00:55:27,412

Yeah.

:

00:55:27,497 --> 00:55:27,977

Xhafer: today.

:

00:55:28,057 --> 00:55:28,527

I don't know.

:

00:55:28,727 --> 00:55:29,057

It doesn't

:

00:55:29,057 --> 00:55:29,977

feel like a three.

:

00:55:30,507 --> 00:55:32,627

I feel like it could have

been a three, but it's not

:

00:55:32,862 --> 00:55:37,482

Laura: Yeah, I would, I'll join you

on the two and a half step, like,

:

00:55:37,817 --> 00:55:42,207

Xhafer: cut the useless reporter out of

here who only is in this to be objectified

:

00:55:42,602 --> 00:55:43,032

Laura: yeah,

:

00:55:43,527 --> 00:55:44,377

Xhafer: to give

:

00:55:44,377 --> 00:55:45,747

Sheridan a joke.

:

00:55:45,887 --> 00:55:46,247

Yeah.

:

00:55:46,902 --> 00:55:48,402

And humiliate 100 percent humiliated.

:

00:55:48,852 --> 00:55:49,652

Cut all that out.

:

00:55:50,032 --> 00:55:52,852

Just have this be Sheridan's

picking this kid up on the way

:

00:55:52,852 --> 00:55:54,322

to be five for the celebration.

:

00:55:54,322 --> 00:55:58,872

So that way you have the end the plots

at B5 like you wanted to and give

:

00:55:58,872 --> 00:56:03,352

us more interactions with Sheridan

and Ventari or start this farther

:

00:56:03,352 --> 00:56:07,222

back and show some shit with Ventari

being treated like a piece of shit.

:

00:56:07,582 --> 00:56:12,502

Like I don't know if the story works

as well if he's at all sympathetic.

:

00:56:13,737 --> 00:56:16,537

If the, if that changes the nature

of the question being asked.

:

00:56:17,017 --> 00:56:19,007

Um, so maybe, maybe that's

not the route to go.

:

00:56:19,007 --> 00:56:22,667

Maybe you do stuff with him where

you may raise more questions and make

:

00:56:22,667 --> 00:56:24,257

this a harder decision for Sheridan.

:

00:56:24,767 --> 00:56:28,197

But I think that would do a

lot for this episode as opposed

:

00:56:28,197 --> 00:56:29,837

to fucking quantum space.

:

00:56:30,317 --> 00:56:31,137

Fuck off.

:

00:56:31,636 --> 00:56:32,206

Laura: Yeah.

:

00:56:32,766 --> 00:56:38,530

This, man, I just realized that this

vignette, or whatever we want to call

:

00:56:38,530 --> 00:56:44,202

it, this little lost tale, is like, oh,

we're all just looking for a good dad.

:

00:56:44,762 --> 00:56:46,252

He just needs a good dad.

:

00:56:47,372 --> 00:56:51,182

And Sheridan's going to step

up and be good dad once again.

:

00:56:52,372 --> 00:56:54,162

Xhafer: Just the best dad, best stepdad.

:

00:56:54,432 --> 00:56:55,442

That's what, that's his goal.

:

00:56:56,082 --> 00:56:57,742

Universe's best stepdad.

:

00:56:57,742 --> 00:56:59,522

If he had a mug, that's what it would say.

:

00:56:59,982 --> 00:57:00,442

Laura: Mm hmm.

:

00:57:00,886 --> 00:57:01,916

Xhafer: Number one, president.

:

00:57:01,926 --> 00:57:02,726

That's his other mug,

:

00:57:04,166 --> 00:57:05,346

the land credit for him.

:

00:57:05,756 --> 00:57:06,616

Laura: For sure.

:

00:57:06,766 --> 00:57:08,156

Xhafer: doesn't understand Christmas, but

:

00:57:08,236 --> 00:57:09,246

she knows that it's important.

:

00:57:09,256 --> 00:57:09,796

Holy day.

:

00:57:09,796 --> 00:57:13,246

So she got him a mug that says

Alliance's number one president.

:

00:57:14,811 --> 00:57:17,481

Laura: Which is technically

true, as he is the first.

:

00:57:19,636 --> 00:57:21,706

Xhafer: De facto, the worst

president they've ever had.

:

00:57:22,206 --> 00:57:23,616

So the election is next week.

:

00:57:23,986 --> 00:57:24,596

Anyways,

:

00:57:25,831 --> 00:57:28,191

Laura: Anyways at least it looked nice.

:

00:57:28,851 --> 00:57:28,931

The

:

00:57:28,931 --> 00:57:29,801

CGI looked

:

00:57:29,801 --> 00:57:30,421

really nice.

:

00:57:30,921 --> 00:57:34,001

And the opening little

theme song, I was like, aw,

:

00:57:34,216 --> 00:57:35,296

Xhafer: those DVD credits.

:

00:57:35,296 --> 00:57:35,686

Yeah.

:

00:57:36,086 --> 00:57:36,986

The DVD menu.

:

00:57:37,046 --> 00:57:37,336

Yeah.

:

00:57:38,551 --> 00:57:39,231

Laura: It was good though.

:

00:57:39,836 --> 00:57:40,186

Xhafer: Yeah.

:

00:57:40,646 --> 00:57:43,756

It could have done with some characters,

weirdly morphing into other characters

:

00:57:43,756 --> 00:57:46,446

for my taste, but that's just me

:

00:57:46,721 --> 00:57:49,371

Laura: What is a DVD menu if

it doesn't have the characters

:

00:57:49,396 --> 00:57:51,656

Xhafer: Ryan, but besides the two of us,

:

00:57:53,042 --> 00:57:53,992

Laura: We all love it.

:

00:57:54,022 --> 00:57:54,722

You know what?

:

00:57:55,177 --> 00:57:55,977

Xhafer: I'm so tired.

:

00:57:56,369 --> 00:57:57,419

I don't want to do this.

:

00:57:57,974 --> 00:57:58,954

Laura: You don't want to end this one?

:

00:57:59,364 --> 00:58:03,544

Xhafer: I don't want to, because when we

end this one, I'm going to go get water

:

00:58:03,594 --> 00:58:06,244

and then we're, we're going to start the

next one and the next one's the last one,

:

00:58:06,654 --> 00:58:10,644

and that has emotional implications and

:

00:58:12,494 --> 00:58:15,214

Laura: Ja'far's going to drank

out this outro just so he

:

00:58:15,214 --> 00:58:16,534

doesn't have to have feelings.

:

00:58:17,609 --> 00:58:20,829

Xhafer: men would literally host

149 episodes of podcasts rather

:

00:58:20,829 --> 00:58:23,996

than go to therapy anyways.

:

00:58:24,696 --> 00:58:25,296

All right.

:

00:58:25,296 --> 00:58:29,806

Well, next week we're coming back

with that, our, our Babylon five

:

00:58:29,816 --> 00:58:33,286

retrospective hundred 50th episode.

:

00:58:33,998 --> 00:58:35,338

Sass tacular.

:

00:58:35,478 --> 00:58:35,538

I don't know.

:

00:58:35,578 --> 00:58:36,318

Spectacular.

:

00:58:36,318 --> 00:58:37,368

It doesn't seem right.

:

00:58:38,293 --> 00:58:44,093

Uh, So join us then for a

celebration of Babylon five.

:

00:58:44,928 --> 00:58:47,008

In the sassiest way possible.

:

00:58:47,008 --> 00:58:48,698

We'll try to be nice to the show.

:

00:58:48,698 --> 00:58:52,918

I guess we, I mean, I do love the show,

but we'll also be talking probably more

:

00:58:52,918 --> 00:58:55,518

about us and the podcast and stuff.

:

00:58:55,518 --> 00:58:56,418

So that's next week.

:

00:58:56,858 --> 00:58:57,638

But until then.

:

00:58:58,178 --> 00:58:59,858

We got to say thank you to Jeremy Siegel.

:

00:58:59,948 --> 00:59:02,918

Thanks so much, Jeremy,

for making our theme music.

:

00:59:02,968 --> 00:59:04,208

We appreciate the hell out of it.

:

00:59:04,338 --> 00:59:07,108

You can find more of Jeremy's

work at Jeremy Siegel, 42.

:

00:59:07,108 --> 00:59:07,138

bandcamp.

:

00:59:07,138 --> 00:59:07,468

com.

:

00:59:07,818 --> 00:59:09,668

And I'm streaming services

as nuclear Jaguar.

:

00:59:09,818 --> 00:59:11,958

Are you texting him right now

to ask about the new theme?

:

00:59:12,163 --> 00:59:14,413

Laura: No, no, I'm setting up a thing.

:

00:59:14,413 --> 00:59:16,903

So, also thank you to angry

duck time machine on Instagram

:

00:59:17,423 --> 00:59:18,623

for our podcast artwork.

:

00:59:18,963 --> 00:59:23,233

And I'm currently sending

Jaffer the new podcast artwork.

:

00:59:24,558 --> 00:59:25,258

Xhafer: I'm going to see it.

:

00:59:25,298 --> 00:59:27,468

I'm going to, I'm covering up.

:

00:59:27,538 --> 00:59:30,108

I'm minimizing my other

monitors so that I can't see it.

:

00:59:30,128 --> 00:59:31,968

I'm going to watch it in between episodes.

:

00:59:32,028 --> 00:59:32,558

I'll pull it up.

:

00:59:32,798 --> 00:59:34,568

I'll we'll do a live

react on the next episode.

:

00:59:34,568 --> 00:59:34,818

I'll pull

:

00:59:34,883 --> 00:59:35,583

Laura: Okay.

:

00:59:35,883 --> 00:59:37,793

The new podcast artwork is

:

00:59:37,823 --> 00:59:38,203

Xhafer: artwork.

:

00:59:38,863 --> 00:59:40,023

Oh, I'm excited.

:

00:59:40,093 --> 00:59:41,543

I get to change my discord image.

:

00:59:42,353 --> 00:59:42,953

Laura: Okay.

:

00:59:43,113 --> 00:59:43,553

Okay.

:

00:59:44,243 --> 00:59:46,513

And thanks, Aaron.

:

00:59:47,113 --> 00:59:47,903

Thanks a bunch.

:

00:59:48,263 --> 00:59:49,013

Xhafer: Thank you so much.

:

00:59:50,143 --> 00:59:50,513

Laura: We make

:

00:59:50,663 --> 00:59:56,263

Xhafer: over editing this podcast at

like episode 30 or whatever, it was a

:

00:59:56,263 --> 01:00:02,163

while ago, you've edited a whole lot of

podcast, my dude, a whole lot of podcast.

:

01:00:02,193 --> 01:00:05,243

Like you've got credentials

to get a job doing this if you

:

01:00:05,243 --> 01:00:07,433

want it and you're good at it.

:

01:00:08,233 --> 01:00:11,493

And we really appreciate that you

take that time and that effort and

:

01:00:11,493 --> 01:00:13,503

that energy and put it into a podcast.

:

01:00:14,033 --> 01:00:18,103

Our silly hobby and

everyone else's enjoyment.

:

01:00:18,193 --> 01:00:19,553

They all appreciate you too, Aaron.

:

01:00:19,563 --> 01:00:20,973

I'm going to speak on

behalf of the audience.

:

01:00:21,203 --> 01:00:23,843

Everyone really appreciates you

making us not sound like shit.

:

01:00:24,578 --> 01:00:28,028

Laura: and it boggles my mind that

he willingly listens to my voice

:

01:00:28,068 --> 01:00:30,238

over and over and over again.

:

01:00:30,763 --> 01:00:32,343

Xhafer: Well, he wants

to listen to your voice.

:

01:00:32,343 --> 01:00:32,963

I don't know what he's doing.

:

01:00:32,963 --> 01:00:33,723

Listening to me.

:

01:00:34,993 --> 01:00:36,753

He signed on to listen to you.

:

01:00:36,793 --> 01:00:37,983

I'm the accessory

:

01:00:38,168 --> 01:00:40,848

Laura: It's true, but you

know, sometimes you, you don't

:

01:00:40,848 --> 01:00:42,788

want more of the thing, right?

:

01:00:45,443 --> 01:00:46,373

Xhafer: I mean, we can both agree.

:

01:00:46,373 --> 01:00:48,223

It's better than listening to ourselves.

:

01:00:48,688 --> 01:00:49,288

Laura: For sure.

:

01:00:49,318 --> 01:00:50,508

That's just the worst.

:

01:00:50,938 --> 01:00:56,208

Although it was pretty great on those

two episodes of Crusade that we did.

:

01:00:56,218 --> 01:00:59,348

I did put up with myself because I

:

01:00:59,553 --> 01:01:01,503

Xhafer: I had to hear how it came out.

:

01:01:01,503 --> 01:01:01,573

Yeah.

:

01:01:03,038 --> 01:01:03,278

All right.

:

01:01:03,278 --> 01:01:05,618

Well, we'll see you next time, internet.

:

01:01:05,638 --> 01:01:06,548

We'll see you next week.

:

01:01:07,213 --> 01:01:07,493

Laura: Bye.

:

01:01:08,038 --> 01:01:08,198

Xhafer: Bye.

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About the Podcast

Who Are You?
A Babylon 5 Watchcast
Join Laura and Xhafer, two internet strangers as they get to know each other while making jokes about one of their favorite TV shows from their childhood, Babylon 5.